If they trade Keller are we thinking something like Beavers and Mayo combo comes back from orioles? I think that would be fair, but both taking a risk. Mayo and Beavers could be studs or duds. Then what go sign a Tyler Anderson or Quintana for lefty in rotation? I still think I’d rather have Keller
You’d probably need to trade at least five or six Kellers to bring back Beavers and Mayo. Realistically, something like Ashcraft for Beavers makes sense as a baseball trade. Keller has very little surplus value, it would likely take a perfect storm to get anything more than a platoon bat back for him. I would go as far to say that individually Ortiz and Oviedo had more trade value prior to their respective trades than Keller does now. Keller’s contract is basically market value for a player of his age and caliber.
That’s kind of what I was thinking - but a lot of people make it seem like they’ll get a haul for him. Thought those are two guys or even Kjerstad with upside and control. I think I hang on to Keller unless you can get a couple horwitz’s. And use the remaining money you saved on another starter and leverage reliever.
I think the Pirates have to keep the Rotation of Skenes, Keller, Burrows, and Chandler the foursome that finished 2025 after Falter was dealt. At times Ashcraft (8 Starts) was the 5th SP, or Oviedo (9 Starts), or Mlodzinski (12 Starts) were also used as the 5th SP. The mystery men in all of this are Jared Jones, Hunter Barco, and Thomas Harrington - what can they provide in 2026. Oviedo is gone.
If we can get a LH MOTO bat like Dylan Beavers for Braxton Ashcraft as the primary, we need to make the move and light candles for good health and that Jared Jones returns from his "quickie" TJ and can be part of the Rotation by May. Harrington hit the wall last year and we have to wait until ST to see where he is at for this year. If Jones and Harrington are not ready, we go to Hunter Barco as the 5th SP with Mlodzinski as the fallback 5th SP in what could be Bullpen Games for the most part. I think Barco is ready - 23 Starts last year 6 at AA (25.2 IP), then 17 Starts at AAA (74 IP), then 2 games at MLB (3 IP).
I would rather they do that than sit on prime trade talent when we need that to get us the bat we must have in order to have any chance at making the playoffs.
I'd rather they kept Ashcroft and traded Keller, use his money to get Okamato signed. The grab a veteran SP and back end reliever off the scrap pile. Use any remaining money to sign another outfielder. 26 is the year to compete for playoffs and see what these young guys can do.
Just got my Minor League Guide about an hour ago. Great work by all involved. Enjoying the write ups on guys I haven’t gotten to see much. Like all the extra articles as well. Excellent stuff, gentlemen.
I wonder if Keller's value might increase as the off season progresses. He has some surplus value right now, but any team can shop at the free agent aisle and get someone similar without surrendering assets. But as the supply dwindles, teams (contenders) might really need to fill a rotation hole. It's risky to wait, but they don't need to trade him. Rotation surpluses have a way of working out as spring training progresses.
It also lets them make sure that enough of Burrows, Ashcraft, Chandler, Jones, and Barco are capable of contributing. If so, then move Keller in-season or at the deadline. Of course, that way, his money isn't freed up to spend now.
So we cut how many million about 7 years ago that we didn't spend any of the last several years. Then we cut Bednar, Hayes, Falter and whoever else this year to free up money. We haven't signed a free agent to anything more than a year rental since Ivan Nova. I am not against trading Keller in the right deal, but just don't buy the Keller to free up money narrative until we get a new owner or until he shows us he is willing to spend.
I share your frustration that past savings from moving contracts is never reinvested. And there is no doubt that BN & BC need to prove they will spend rather than just the past, empty promises. So, go get what we need via FAs.
I like this. Even during ST in March, some TOR starter will go down with Tommy John.....and we'll still have Mitch as their insurance policy. And even Ben won't be able to screw up the return value. Well remains to be seen...
Imo, Ashcraft and Burrows haven't shown enough to get a legit bat in return. The Pirates would be trading pitching hope for hitting hope. At this point, they need Nutting to open the wallet and aquire a solid bat for 3B and OF. Maintain the young pitching depth with an eye toward bringing the young guys up from AAA after getting some everyday reps: the password, EV, KG.
Do we think Chandler is untouchable? I go back and forth. I think I'd keep Chandler, Ashcraft, and Burrows. But if any are on the table, then all three should be on the table with Chandler requiring the biggest return followed by Ashcraft and then Burrows. I.e., if we're willing to trade a young starter (other than Skenes), then make all available but for significantly different returns.
I'll bite. I vote no. That is a 2026 or bust trade and while I want to see them spend and make REAL attempts to compete this year, I also don't think it is worth sacrificing that much in both current year trade value but hopefully significant future on the field value.
I agree it would be fun, but with Skenes I am thinking there are 3 or 4 years left, kind of feel like this would really hurt those other years and we are talking Bubba not Falter in terms of possible high level contribution to winning.
My ground hog day response. Nobody is untouchable (with a huge asterisk by the name Skenes). RedSox are not offering Roman Anthony for Bubba, but if they did - where do I sign no matter what that does to Pirate SP depth. I just don't see how you can't take or initiate the call. The more you want the more you have to offer and vice versa.
If they trade Keller are we thinking something like Beavers and Mayo combo comes back from orioles? I think that would be fair, but both taking a risk. Mayo and Beavers could be studs or duds. Then what go sign a Tyler Anderson or Quintana for lefty in rotation? I still think I’d rather have Keller
You’d probably need to trade at least five or six Kellers to bring back Beavers and Mayo. Realistically, something like Ashcraft for Beavers makes sense as a baseball trade. Keller has very little surplus value, it would likely take a perfect storm to get anything more than a platoon bat back for him. I would go as far to say that individually Ortiz and Oviedo had more trade value prior to their respective trades than Keller does now. Keller’s contract is basically market value for a player of his age and caliber.
That’s kind of what I was thinking - but a lot of people make it seem like they’ll get a haul for him. Thought those are two guys or even Kjerstad with upside and control. I think I hang on to Keller unless you can get a couple horwitz’s. And use the remaining money you saved on another starter and leverage reliever.
I think they keep him to eat innings unless they need to reallocate his salary to a larger FA signing (bat)
If they trade Ashcraft, they better get the modern day equivalent of Starling Marte type value in return. Like Dylan Beavers as Mel would say.
I think the Pirates have to keep the Rotation of Skenes, Keller, Burrows, and Chandler the foursome that finished 2025 after Falter was dealt. At times Ashcraft (8 Starts) was the 5th SP, or Oviedo (9 Starts), or Mlodzinski (12 Starts) were also used as the 5th SP. The mystery men in all of this are Jared Jones, Hunter Barco, and Thomas Harrington - what can they provide in 2026. Oviedo is gone.
If we can get a LH MOTO bat like Dylan Beavers for Braxton Ashcraft as the primary, we need to make the move and light candles for good health and that Jared Jones returns from his "quickie" TJ and can be part of the Rotation by May. Harrington hit the wall last year and we have to wait until ST to see where he is at for this year. If Jones and Harrington are not ready, we go to Hunter Barco as the 5th SP with Mlodzinski as the fallback 5th SP in what could be Bullpen Games for the most part. I think Barco is ready - 23 Starts last year 6 at AA (25.2 IP), then 17 Starts at AAA (74 IP), then 2 games at MLB (3 IP).
I would rather they do that than sit on prime trade talent when we need that to get us the bat we must have in order to have any chance at making the playoffs.
I’d hope there’s enough $ laying around to get two solid bats. Would like to hold on to Ashcraft. Then, trade Harrington, etc. for some reliever(s).
I'd rather they kept Ashcroft and traded Keller, use his money to get Okamato signed. The grab a veteran SP and back end reliever off the scrap pile. Use any remaining money to sign another outfielder. 26 is the year to compete for playoffs and see what these young guys can do.
Just got my Minor League Guide about an hour ago. Great work by all involved. Enjoying the write ups on guys I haven’t gotten to see much. Like all the extra articles as well. Excellent stuff, gentlemen.
Agree.. very well done. Mine came earlier this week.
I wonder if Keller's value might increase as the off season progresses. He has some surplus value right now, but any team can shop at the free agent aisle and get someone similar without surrendering assets. But as the supply dwindles, teams (contenders) might really need to fill a rotation hole. It's risky to wait, but they don't need to trade him. Rotation surpluses have a way of working out as spring training progresses.
It also lets them make sure that enough of Burrows, Ashcraft, Chandler, Jones, and Barco are capable of contributing. If so, then move Keller in-season or at the deadline. Of course, that way, his money isn't freed up to spend now.
So we cut how many million about 7 years ago that we didn't spend any of the last several years. Then we cut Bednar, Hayes, Falter and whoever else this year to free up money. We haven't signed a free agent to anything more than a year rental since Ivan Nova. I am not against trading Keller in the right deal, but just don't buy the Keller to free up money narrative until we get a new owner or until he shows us he is willing to spend.
I share your frustration that past savings from moving contracts is never reinvested. And there is no doubt that BN & BC need to prove they will spend rather than just the past, empty promises. So, go get what we need via FAs.
I like this. Even during ST in March, some TOR starter will go down with Tommy John.....and we'll still have Mitch as their insurance policy. And even Ben won't be able to screw up the return value. Well remains to be seen...
Don't sell Ben short. He's a tremendous screw-up.
Imo, Ashcraft and Burrows haven't shown enough to get a legit bat in return. The Pirates would be trading pitching hope for hitting hope. At this point, they need Nutting to open the wallet and aquire a solid bat for 3B and OF. Maintain the young pitching depth with an eye toward bringing the young guys up from AAA after getting some everyday reps: the password, EV, KG.
Do we think Chandler is untouchable? I go back and forth. I think I'd keep Chandler, Ashcraft, and Burrows. But if any are on the table, then all three should be on the table with Chandler requiring the biggest return followed by Ashcraft and then Burrows. I.e., if we're willing to trade a young starter (other than Skenes), then make all available but for significantly different returns.
Would you trade Chandler and a couple 11 to 20 prospects, if it brought back one year of Skubal?
I'll bite. I vote no. That is a 2026 or bust trade and while I want to see them spend and make REAL attempts to compete this year, I also don't think it is worth sacrificing that much in both current year trade value but hopefully significant future on the field value.
I think it would be fun finding a way to sneak in the play-offs with Skubal-Skenes in these short series with all the days off that they plan.
I agree it would be fun, but with Skenes I am thinking there are 3 or 4 years left, kind of feel like this would really hurt those other years and we are talking Bubba not Falter in terms of possible high level contribution to winning.
For me, he’s very close to untouchable. It’d have to be something overwhelmingly good to pull the trigger, other than that, I’m good with keeping him
My ground hog day response. Nobody is untouchable (with a huge asterisk by the name Skenes). RedSox are not offering Roman Anthony for Bubba, but if they did - where do I sign no matter what that does to Pirate SP depth. I just don't see how you can't take or initiate the call. The more you want the more you have to offer and vice versa.
With Oviedo gone, I doubt Keller gets moved this winter (unless the Mets lose their minds and offer Jett in return).
I wouldn’t love seeing either Burrows or Ashcraft leave, but they would definitely bring some quality bat.
I would be more in favor of Kelly, Dotel or Harrington being moved, but I don’t think they are bringing as much as either Burrows or Ashcraft.