My handy dandy Tuesday morning MiLB preview tells me Akron is the second worst offense in the league while Erie, the second *best* offense in the league, just hung 5 earned in three innings on him two starts ago.
Chandler was pitching really good against Erie, got the first 6 guys out. He did give up a homerun to the first batter in the 3rd, it was a double digit 10+ pitch count at bat with a 2-2 count. But the first ball called sure as hell looked like strike 3 in my opinion. He gave up a double to the next batter, then got the next 3 out.
The 4th kinda sucked for him a pop up that dropped then the only walk that he gave up, sure looked to me that he got squeezed, 3 borderline pitches 1 was definitely a ball but the other 2 looked like they were strikes. A solid single loaded the bases next. Then 2 strikeouts the second one to the guy that hit the homerun, followed by a bases clearing double to the guy that got the double in the 3rd inning. Another single ended his day and left him with 5 earned runs. His line looked a lot worse than what my eyes told me.
I know ifs and buts. He could have been going into the 5th with 8 or 9 strikeouts and zero earned runs on around 65 to 70 pitches.
Not at all my interest in debbie downing him while he's on a heater, but we just watched Jared Jones pull a month of 70-grade command out of nowhere before regressing right back to where he's always been.
I like what Longenhagen wrote on Chandler, dev has gone about as well as you could expect so far and good command projection into his 20s. I'm just not quite there yet.
I follow what you are saying, doubt is creeping in about Jones, he has two above average pitches that need command to be above average, his less than ideal built…..let’s just say that I’m glad if he settles into a good 3.
Guys have peaks and valleys. Let’s see how he adjusts. Even though he’s been less effective the last 7 weeks or so there really only two “bad” starts of the eight he’s had in that time frame.
The question is how many people would be ok if he was the center piece in acquiring a legit bat with a year or two of control. I’m on the ok side of it.
Another consideration is, as outlined in today’s PG article, is that Jones and Skenes are going to be limited in innings which will hurt our chances in making the postseason. Because of that, we’re probably not as close as we’re tempted to think we are every time we see Jones or Skenes dominate.
The legit bats aren't legit enough in my mind. Luis Robert is interesting but injuries make it a risk, and he has been good outside of a stretch or 2 where he was WOW. Taylor Ward makes some sense, and feels about the right level, just something feels weird about how excited we are for Bubba to be traded for Ward....
I'd much rather convince the powers that be that Cutch should be our RF, then go acquire JD Martinez to be our everyday DH. I can't imagine he won't be able to be acquired for a little less than taking the salary plus a 10-15 ranked prospect for us.
I'd be up for a challenge trade / change of scenery centered around Suwinski for Torkleson as well (as example) as well
I honestly think the Pirates could be ahead of the Cardinals and Padres right now, but I don't think our players have bought in to what it takes as a team. Or haven't bought into the excitement or urgency of making the play-offs. If this turns around and we get a few games above .500, I am all in for a good trade.
Let's take care of first things first. I don't want to lose a Bubba Chandler to make up for mistakes that aren't getting taken care of internally.
If you’re talking bad running, defense? Sure. Although I’m not sure how they measure up league wide, in those categories. They can’t be as bad as at the plate.
My issue with your original take is…bad players don’t lose because a lack of fire or caring. They lose because they’re bad. Fans often take out the frustration of losing on the players, acting like they don’t care. They do.
We are probably in agreement that we have about 6 players in the line-up that are average players or below average players. That is why we are where we are..
Now to say we couldn't have been a few games better because we don't run hard out of the box, we are going to disagree. We have one guy of the left side of the infield that hit .300 with 10 homers in August/September and won a gold glove last year. We have another guy on the left side of the infield that can't run hard on a double play.
Joe, Delay, Nick, Jack, Taylor, Triolo all come to play every day.
The pirates aren’t losing because of “attitude” or lack of “chemistry” or “buyin”. Come on. They are all working professionally as hard as they can. If they don’t “look the part” to you that’s your bias and it has nothing to do with why they lose. They lose because they aren’t good enough hitters.
The Pirates are 39-42 at the break and they are winning because of their pitching. They are losing because they don't have enough hitting. If you say most are working professionally as hard as they can, I agree. To say that they are ALL working as hard as they can just isn't true. Sometimes Cruz runs hard. The other day he jogged on a ground ball double play. I'm not sure Hayes has run hard to first in the last week. We have a pitcher yelling at himself on the mound when he should have been backing up home plate. We have some players that spend too much time feeling sorry for themselves and yes it hurts the team. Not ready to trade Chandler for this group yet. Sorry.
I'll try not to pile on my man Stats here but I do find it funny that the kind of emotive players fans love are also probably the polar opposite of what you want to see out of a baseball player.
Bryan Reynolds is the ideal. Never too high and never too low. And fans hate it.
The expression on his face stays the same. Never too high and never too low. But I hope you aren't saying he is Mr. Consistent because month to month hitting is often lower than what you would expect or higher than what you would expect.
Not being contrarian to be contrarian but I actually love watching Reynolds play, personally. He clearly cares and has his own sort of intensity but it's not up and down like you said.
When I weigh the odds of us coming out of the wildcard race and the chance that a Cherington acquisition will outperform what we’d get from, say, Suwinski or Bae or Joe, I’m opposed to trading any of our top 3-4 pitching prospects. Part of that is Cherington’s track record (or lack thereof) of acquiring impact bats. Let’s just lean in to what we might do well, identifying and developing pitching, and hope that some of our bats experience the kind of turnaround Tellez has had.
This doesn’t mean we can’t make a Byrd or Lee-type deal, just not one involving a top pitching prospect.
I wouldn't necessarily be against it but I wouldn't include him in a trade without seeing what his next few starts look like. If his dominance continues his value will skyrocket. He is on his way to being a top 5 rhp prospect, if not overall pitching prospect. Not many 21 year olds can hold upper 90's velocity with control deep into games.
I've already stated my feelings about Bubba, and what his addition means to the staff, but add Ashcraft, Burrow, some of the young prospects working their way up....... Somebody will get hurt, but including the depth we're talking about potentially a generational pitching staff. They could consider trading Keller for offense. Not that I want them too, but he should get a good return given that he's a horse.
Just missed a 12th strikeout on the first hit in the 7th. The ball either hit home plate or right in front of it off the bat. Almost looked like a pop up to 3rd. Ball stayed in the air long enough McAdoo didn't have a chance.
Chandler was still holding his velocity in the 7th inning of both games 96 to 99mph.
The Pirates should not trade Bubba Chandler. I believe his value will skyrocket in the very near future. They can acquire bats without giving up Chandler.
My handy dandy Tuesday morning MiLB preview tells me Akron is the second worst offense in the league while Erie, the second *best* offense in the league, just hung 5 earned in three innings on him two starts ago.
Upside, no doubt.
Chandler was pitching really good against Erie, got the first 6 guys out. He did give up a homerun to the first batter in the 3rd, it was a double digit 10+ pitch count at bat with a 2-2 count. But the first ball called sure as hell looked like strike 3 in my opinion. He gave up a double to the next batter, then got the next 3 out.
The 4th kinda sucked for him a pop up that dropped then the only walk that he gave up, sure looked to me that he got squeezed, 3 borderline pitches 1 was definitely a ball but the other 2 looked like they were strikes. A solid single loaded the bases next. Then 2 strikeouts the second one to the guy that hit the homerun, followed by a bases clearing double to the guy that got the double in the 3rd inning. Another single ended his day and left him with 5 earned runs. His line looked a lot worse than what my eyes told me.
I know ifs and buts. He could have been going into the 5th with 8 or 9 strikeouts and zero earned runs on around 65 to 70 pitches.
Eesh, two of his other starts over this post-IL heater were also against Richmond, the worst offense in the league.
But yeah, higher upside than Skenes!
Not at all my interest in debbie downing him while he's on a heater, but we just watched Jared Jones pull a month of 70-grade command out of nowhere before regressing right back to where he's always been.
I like what Longenhagen wrote on Chandler, dev has gone about as well as you could expect so far and good command projection into his 20s. I'm just not quite there yet.
I follow what you are saying, doubt is creeping in about Jones, he has two above average pitches that need command to be above average, his less than ideal built…..let’s just say that I’m glad if he settles into a good 3.
Jones sample is still quite small. We won’t know what he is for a few years. Look at Keller. A pitcher isn’t a 1,2 or 3 innately. It takes time
I've been dreaming of a Scherzer situation for Jones.
Max really wasn't MAX until his 5th season in the show.
Less than optimal timing for the Pirates but good for Jared.
4.31 FIP and a 4 bb/9 since 5/10 with k/9 down to 8.2.
Guys have peaks and valleys. Let’s see how he adjusts. Even though he’s been less effective the last 7 weeks or so there really only two “bad” starts of the eight he’s had in that time frame.
My hesitation is that this "valley" looks exactly like his spring training and AAA and AA.
The question is how many people would be ok if he was the center piece in acquiring a legit bat with a year or two of control. I’m on the ok side of it.
Another consideration is, as outlined in today’s PG article, is that Jones and Skenes are going to be limited in innings which will hurt our chances in making the postseason. Because of that, we’re probably not as close as we’re tempted to think we are every time we see Jones or Skenes dominate.
The legit bats aren't legit enough in my mind. Luis Robert is interesting but injuries make it a risk, and he has been good outside of a stretch or 2 where he was WOW. Taylor Ward makes some sense, and feels about the right level, just something feels weird about how excited we are for Bubba to be traded for Ward....
I'd much rather convince the powers that be that Cutch should be our RF, then go acquire JD Martinez to be our everyday DH. I can't imagine he won't be able to be acquired for a little less than taking the salary plus a 10-15 ranked prospect for us.
I'd be up for a challenge trade / change of scenery centered around Suwinski for Torkleson as well (as example) as well
Not against, but ideally 2 years beyond this year of control and has to be the right deal for sure
I honestly think the Pirates could be ahead of the Cardinals and Padres right now, but I don't think our players have bought in to what it takes as a team. Or haven't bought into the excitement or urgency of making the play-offs. If this turns around and we get a few games above .500, I am all in for a good trade.
Let's take care of first things first. I don't want to lose a Bubba Chandler to make up for mistakes that aren't getting taken care of internally.
That’s a load. They lose primarily because they can’t hit. End of story.
They lose primarily because they can't hit. They still have corrections that need to be made along with getting better hitters.
If you’re talking bad running, defense? Sure. Although I’m not sure how they measure up league wide, in those categories. They can’t be as bad as at the plate.
My issue with your original take is…bad players don’t lose because a lack of fire or caring. They lose because they’re bad. Fans often take out the frustration of losing on the players, acting like they don’t care. They do.
We are probably in agreement that we have about 6 players in the line-up that are average players or below average players. That is why we are where we are..
Now to say we couldn't have been a few games better because we don't run hard out of the box, we are going to disagree. We have one guy of the left side of the infield that hit .300 with 10 homers in August/September and won a gold glove last year. We have another guy on the left side of the infield that can't run hard on a double play.
Joe, Delay, Nick, Jack, Taylor, Triolo all come to play every day.
No Reynolds in that group?
The pirates aren’t losing because of “attitude” or lack of “chemistry” or “buyin”. Come on. They are all working professionally as hard as they can. If they don’t “look the part” to you that’s your bias and it has nothing to do with why they lose. They lose because they aren’t good enough hitters.
The Pirates are 39-42 at the break and they are winning because of their pitching. They are losing because they don't have enough hitting. If you say most are working professionally as hard as they can, I agree. To say that they are ALL working as hard as they can just isn't true. Sometimes Cruz runs hard. The other day he jogged on a ground ball double play. I'm not sure Hayes has run hard to first in the last week. We have a pitcher yelling at himself on the mound when he should have been backing up home plate. We have some players that spend too much time feeling sorry for themselves and yes it hurts the team. Not ready to trade Chandler for this group yet. Sorry.
Harrumph!
I'll try not to pile on my man Stats here but I do find it funny that the kind of emotive players fans love are also probably the polar opposite of what you want to see out of a baseball player.
Bryan Reynolds is the ideal. Never too high and never too low. And fans hate it.
The expression on his face stays the same. Never too high and never too low. But I hope you aren't saying he is Mr. Consistent because month to month hitting is often lower than what you would expect or higher than what you would expect.
Where does he end up though? Consistently above average. Isn’t that what matters?
An all-star for sure. I like the guy.
I like Stats...good commenter. But this particular comment, he's saying Shelton is the reason the Pirates aren't in 2nd place, without saying Shelton.
Never mentioned Shelton. Talking about certain players that need to step up.
Not being contrarian to be contrarian but I actually love watching Reynolds play, personally. He clearly cares and has his own sort of intensity but it's not up and down like you said.
I'm in love with Reynolds. Especially how he plays the game
hell yeah brother.
When I weigh the odds of us coming out of the wildcard race and the chance that a Cherington acquisition will outperform what we’d get from, say, Suwinski or Bae or Joe, I’m opposed to trading any of our top 3-4 pitching prospects. Part of that is Cherington’s track record (or lack thereof) of acquiring impact bats. Let’s just lean in to what we might do well, identifying and developing pitching, and hope that some of our bats experience the kind of turnaround Tellez has had.
This doesn’t mean we can’t make a Byrd or Lee-type deal, just not one involving a top pitching prospect.
I wouldn't necessarily be against it but I wouldn't include him in a trade without seeing what his next few starts look like. If his dominance continues his value will skyrocket. He is on his way to being a top 5 rhp prospect, if not overall pitching prospect. Not many 21 year olds can hold upper 90's velocity with control deep into games.
That’s a bit rich for me at the moment.
Did you watch his last 2 starts?
It’s two starts, Mel. I’m gonna keep it in first for the time being.
It's a simple question.
Yep, he had two awesome games in a row. He’s a good pitching prospect Mel. No one’s saying otherwise.
I've already stated my feelings about Bubba, and what his addition means to the staff, but add Ashcraft, Burrow, some of the young prospects working their way up....... Somebody will get hurt, but including the depth we're talking about potentially a generational pitching staff. They could consider trading Keller for offense. Not that I want them too, but he should get a good return given that he's a horse.
Cherrington will need to trade someone or two for hitting because there is no hitter near to the Majors that could help.
Bubba is the best banana in the bunch
Better than Skenes
Lefty in the strip tell you that one?
roller coaster operator - same guy hoping to join the big leagues in kennywood one day
Blasphemous
St. Paul of the Mound
21 swinging strikes yesterday. And the two runs scored after he left with two on and two out.
Just missed a 12th strikeout on the first hit in the 7th. The ball either hit home plate or right in front of it off the bat. Almost looked like a pop up to 3rd. Ball stayed in the air long enough McAdoo didn't have a chance.
Chandler was still holding his velocity in the 7th inning of both games 96 to 99mph.
The Pirates should not trade Bubba Chandler. I believe his value will skyrocket in the very near future. They can acquire bats without giving up Chandler.
I agree unless it's too good of a deal to turn down.
Yes.
Wyatt Langford