LOL `Peguero and a mid range prospect for Rooker` mock trade seen in the wild on a Pirates blog. This deadline has been hilarious. BTV—again not gospel—has Rooker as worth 5x Peggy.
Holderman nearly put my frequent request/assertion about relievers to the test.
I’ve said so many times, just please don’t walk guys. If you attack guys and just get smoked (your stuff isn’t 100% that day, or a couple batters close their eyes and get lucky, or whatever), I won’t love it but I’ll forgive you a lot faster than if you hand out a bunch of freebies and get beat beat that way.
That would be a huge boost for next year, but I think Diaz and Lowe are a combined 7 for 46 since the all star break with only one extra base hit and one walk between them. Not sure the Pirates staff would be quick at getting these two out of their slumps.
By looking at the standings, we are already contenders..... but to your point by looking at line-ups.... not anywhere close.
If you look at it as a 3-23 that's just every other week for Cutch, no problem. Also guys prob get in their heads a bit when they hear they're trade targets.
If so, that means Cutch hits .310 on the other weeks. The point is we would be replacing guys that have struggled to hit with guys that have been struggling to hit. Good for next year, not an immediate improvement, imo. The good news with their struggles, is they might be affordable. Worth looking into.
That's probably close to what Cutch does, honestly. I doubt their struggles will last and they'll likely hit closer to career norms, both of them. For Diaz, that's a ton of upside and for Lowe a bit less.
See, Skenes messed things up. The Pirates weren’t supposed to be competitive this year and we screwed up the slow evolution towards contention plan. Our prospects are too valuable to trade and god forbid they should make a mistake or overpay. I think we’re looking at Lane Thomas at best.
I believe you are right when you suggest the FO did not expect to contend for anything this year. But, alas, the team got off to a strong start and, when the offensive disaster emerged and wins became scarce, Skenes was promoted. The Pirates and the rest of the MLML then realized that Skenes did not need seasoning, that he was ready to dominate from the get go. Added to Skenes was the excellence Jones displayed and Keller's resurgence after a strong start. Suddenly, the Pirates had a rotation that could pull the team past the McClatchy Line. That would put the Pirates near the wild card in the embarrassingly weak Central Devision. Now the team is having its best season since 2018. What a plan spoiler! The Pirates might make the post-season!
Cherrington likely expected more from Davis, Telez, Taylor, Suwinsky and Hayes. He probably expected the team to finish the year near the McClatchy Line. But that's the risk a team has when it dumpster dives. Your finds might be wholly rotten when put to use. Now Cherrington must work with a team that has enough strength in it's rotation that it might limp into the playoffs. Another problem is this: Its a sad fact that Pirates fans know from first hand experience that Nutting will sell off his players when he gets the spooked by the high payroll demons. I'm sure the capital management skills and culture he and his family developed over decades of operating a cat litter liners masquerading as newspapers business will help him overcome the shame he might feel once he wrecks another Pirates season. After all, look at how many expensive draft picks the team signed. It's noypt as though he did not make the effort. Right?
I expect nothing good over the next two days. If Nuttington effs up the off season...
What bugs me is that Tampa Bay has geniuses in the front office and no fans in the stands. We have fans dying for a winner, ready to sell out every weekend game, and turn out in force even during the week in the summer, but a front office that can’t deliver. So frustrating.
The Trop is a glorified circus tent. The team’s local revenue structure, outside of media, is the inverse of most MLB franchises with only about 20% of revenues generated from corporate sponsorship. This is bc almost all of the “big business” is located in Hillsborough County (i.e., Tampa), which is connected by only three long bridges, while Pinellas County (i.e., St. Pete.) functions primarily as a tourism/hospitality based economy. This obviously skews household type/age and income between the two “areas” with much more favorable demographics in Tampa. They have plans to redevelop the area around the Trop to make it more fan-friendly. However IMO, it will be a colossal waste of money. The stadium absolutely needs to be in Tampa proper for the Rays to have any long-term financial sustainability (demand) in the region. The issue though: the tax payers in Hillsborough County refuse to fund a third stadium after getting exploited by the Bucs (mostly) and Bolts. This has been an ongoing issue for the last ten to 15 years.
I always liked his swing even if it too long. He's n9t only 6'7", he's all arms and legs. It took Judge a season to get it going -- 9f course, he hit 52 HRs in his second year.
A little ways into the season, he was down around 1 or 2, no doubt because he wasn't really over the ankle injury. So he's gotten far better since then.
He has hit over .300 this month: .306/.363/.625. He was atrocious early in the year even though he had a few weeks were he was over .300. He had 45 Ks in March/April. His whiff percentage was atrocious. But he's cut down on the Ks since then.
His launch angle is nearly the same as Juan Sotos's. If he can make more hard contact, we may have a breakout player (no jinx). So far, Cruz has been projection plus insane feats. Hopefully, he's turning that into production.
I always liked his swing. He should hit a lot of line drives if he can make consistent contact. He's hit lasers that we're low to the ground but managed to bounce off the rightfully wall on a fly! He must put the fear of God into first- abd second-basemen.
Wonder if he would consider a long term contract this offseason? Don’t know what it would look like but he already has a major injury and he wasn’t a big bonus signing. He might be more willing than you would think
Bae had a really nice game - got on base twice in 4 abs, stolen base, clutch bunt hit (wow we have a player who can bunt?) and nice athleticism in right field . When he is on, he bring an energy to this team that is needed. I'd give him first shot at replacing Gonzales and then trade for two outfielders tomorrow
SMALL SAMPLE SIZE - did I say SMALL SAMPLE SIZE. Do you bench a guy on a putrid offense who in the month of July has an OPS of .837 mostly in a short side platoon? Oh... he is also by far the best defensive outfielder as a centerfielder. This is not to say MAT was a great signing or a keeper but..... he has been as playable as many in July. Pending any trade they should keep running him out there against lefties. His career says he can hit lefties at an ok rate.
First, I agree he's the teams best defensive CFer, best used in a shortside platoon, defensive replacement or pinch runner.
Second, Your SMALL SAMPLE SIZE argument is complete and total BULLSHIT!!! Take out 1 game on July 5th and his OPS is less than .500 (I'm being generous with .500). Talk about SMALL SAMPLE SIZE! I'll be fair and throw out his worst game an 0 for 4 on July 20th.
47 at bats 7 hits 0 hr 8 bb 21 k
That's a .149 batting average with .170 on base without those 4 hits, 1 was a homerun on the 5th, his slugging is less than .300. Your entire small sample size is based off one freaking game. That's 28 of his last 30 games minus his best and worst game.
First - mea culpa - you took the research on step further and you are correct. What's funny is our conclusion is similar - short side platoon / defense only and I am sure we both would like a REAL upgrade (still strongly think Pillar is not that upgrade). I'll pardon your sarcasm as just anger at the whole Pirate situation since I don't think I partake (have called out some people - well only 2 daily repeaters - a few times) in that banter. To my credit I clearly emphasized small sample size on purpose to be clear I was not predicting some grand production turn around. Go bucs... next few days will be interesting.
It's all good. In an ideal situation Taylor would be a good 4th or 5th outfielder because of his defense an base running abilities. Sadly a true upgrade is probably not happening. The best hope and I'm not counting on it is Bae and Palacios, and that's a long shot at best with neither being close to Taylor defensively.
What if they go get Ward, pillar, Diaz and Rosario? That would fill all their needs but not of these guys are real exciting. I don’t think it would take a lot to get them. They all would be upgrades.
TBH, MAT has outplayed (not by a lot) Pillar for the last 2 months. Pillar had a monster May and outside of that not much. Rosario already looked like a nice add as a backup infielder replacing Triolo before Nick was hurt, now he looks even better. Ward still just feels like Joe to me and his really bad #s since being hit in the head (I think that was the injury) really makes me hesitant to add him. Just my opinions.
There is upside with Ward. Pillar takes Taylor’s spot, Rosario takes Triolo spot and Diaz moves Hayes to the bench. All move the needle. All above league or at league average. Right now they have so many well below league average hitters. I don’t love any of these guys either but just a thought.
If Chappy is traded, we actually could need him with no other LHers in the pen. Or BC will need to get a better LHer which is always a crapshoot off the waiver wire.
I do believe you’re being overly dramatic for effect with these type comments. However, I also believe BC is hesitant to make a “big” move because he knows what happened to the last guy who sat in his chair after he made a “big” move.
When I go on a bender at my age, my entire body hurts. Body aches, apathy, hangxiety. Really try to limit it to a few times per year…holidays, vacation. I’ve found an edible and a few stiff bourbons a couple evenings per week are key to a healthy lifestyle
I'm a former bartender. Have to be careful how much I bartend for myself. Like cocktails a bit too much for my own good. Particularly manhattans. Think my recipe is the closest I've come to mastery in my lifetime. What a thing to waste mastery on haha.
So tough to quit (and maybe you don't want to which is your prerogative). I finally kicked them a few years ago by looking like a moron vaping and reducing nic over about 6 months. Smoking killed both my folks though so it was worth it I guess.
Can we get a dedicated trade deadline forum for Monday and Tuesday ?
With all of the names that have been floated, the biggest name traded has probably been Randy Arozarena.
LOL `Peguero and a mid range prospect for Rooker` mock trade seen in the wild on a Pirates blog. This deadline has been hilarious. BTV—again not gospel—has Rooker as worth 5x Peggy.
Yeah no shot on that one, though certainly would pull the trigger yesterday if that was a real thing!
It'd be more like Ashcraft, Peguero and Suwinski
Especially if we got word that cutch might hang it up after this year, I would still do that
It sounds like Nathaniel Lowe and Yandy Diaz are both available. Would be amazing to get both plus Rooker but I know I'm kidding myself.
What about Brandon Lowe?
You’re kidding yourself.
I know but having Diaz' bat at 3B with Lowe over at 1st and then Rooker in the lineup and we're contenders.
Holderman nearly put my frequent request/assertion about relievers to the test.
I’ve said so many times, just please don’t walk guys. If you attack guys and just get smoked (your stuff isn’t 100% that day, or a couple batters close their eyes and get lucky, or whatever), I won’t love it but I’ll forgive you a lot faster than if you hand out a bunch of freebies and get beat beat that way.
Sure tried to test that one in the tenth 😳😁
That would be a huge boost for next year, but I think Diaz and Lowe are a combined 7 for 46 since the all star break with only one extra base hit and one walk between them. Not sure the Pirates staff would be quick at getting these two out of their slumps.
By looking at the standings, we are already contenders..... but to your point by looking at line-ups.... not anywhere close.
If you look at it as a 3-23 that's just every other week for Cutch, no problem. Also guys prob get in their heads a bit when they hear they're trade targets.
If so, that means Cutch hits .310 on the other weeks. The point is we would be replacing guys that have struggled to hit with guys that have been struggling to hit. Good for next year, not an immediate improvement, imo. The good news with their struggles, is they might be affordable. Worth looking into.
That's probably close to what Cutch does, honestly. I doubt their struggles will last and they'll likely hit closer to career norms, both of them. For Diaz, that's a ton of upside and for Lowe a bit less.
See, Skenes messed things up. The Pirates weren’t supposed to be competitive this year and we screwed up the slow evolution towards contention plan. Our prospects are too valuable to trade and god forbid they should make a mistake or overpay. I think we’re looking at Lane Thomas at best.
I believe you are right when you suggest the FO did not expect to contend for anything this year. But, alas, the team got off to a strong start and, when the offensive disaster emerged and wins became scarce, Skenes was promoted. The Pirates and the rest of the MLML then realized that Skenes did not need seasoning, that he was ready to dominate from the get go. Added to Skenes was the excellence Jones displayed and Keller's resurgence after a strong start. Suddenly, the Pirates had a rotation that could pull the team past the McClatchy Line. That would put the Pirates near the wild card in the embarrassingly weak Central Devision. Now the team is having its best season since 2018. What a plan spoiler! The Pirates might make the post-season!
Cherrington likely expected more from Davis, Telez, Taylor, Suwinsky and Hayes. He probably expected the team to finish the year near the McClatchy Line. But that's the risk a team has when it dumpster dives. Your finds might be wholly rotten when put to use. Now Cherrington must work with a team that has enough strength in it's rotation that it might limp into the playoffs. Another problem is this: Its a sad fact that Pirates fans know from first hand experience that Nutting will sell off his players when he gets the spooked by the high payroll demons. I'm sure the capital management skills and culture he and his family developed over decades of operating a cat litter liners masquerading as newspapers business will help him overcome the shame he might feel once he wrecks another Pirates season. After all, look at how many expensive draft picks the team signed. It's noypt as though he did not make the effort. Right?
I expect nothing good over the next two days. If Nuttington effs up the off season...
Skenes and Jones.
What bugs me is that Tampa Bay has geniuses in the front office and no fans in the stands. We have fans dying for a winner, ready to sell out every weekend game, and turn out in force even during the week in the summer, but a front office that can’t deliver. So frustrating.
Use the desperate fans and Skenes already being here to go get some geniuses to replace the turds we have?
Isn't at least a part of Tampa's attendance problem is that they recycle players so fast that common fans don't have time to have any favorites.
The Trop is a glorified circus tent. The team’s local revenue structure, outside of media, is the inverse of most MLB franchises with only about 20% of revenues generated from corporate sponsorship. This is bc almost all of the “big business” is located in Hillsborough County (i.e., Tampa), which is connected by only three long bridges, while Pinellas County (i.e., St. Pete.) functions primarily as a tourism/hospitality based economy. This obviously skews household type/age and income between the two “areas” with much more favorable demographics in Tampa. They have plans to redevelop the area around the Trop to make it more fan-friendly. However IMO, it will be a colossal waste of money. The stadium absolutely needs to be in Tampa proper for the Rays to have any long-term financial sustainability (demand) in the region. The issue though: the tax payers in Hillsborough County refuse to fund a third stadium after getting exploited by the Bucs (mostly) and Bolts. This has been an ongoing issue for the last ten to 15 years.
Probably a part of it but it's also just the market, location and how fixed income the area is because of such an elderly population etc.
Oneil Cruz in July: .304/.347/.594
I always liked his swing even if it too long. He's n9t only 6'7", he's all arms and legs. It took Judge a season to get it going -- 9f course, he hit 52 HRs in his second year.
Also, his fielding run value, per Statcast, is 50th percentile. He's average defensively, not the liability so many fans seem to think.
It was higher before he kicked the ball around in the last week or so.
A little ways into the season, he was down around 1 or 2, no doubt because he wasn't really over the ankle injury. So he's gotten far better since then.
He has hit over .300 this month: .306/.363/.625. He was atrocious early in the year even though he had a few weeks were he was over .300. He had 45 Ks in March/April. His whiff percentage was atrocious. But he's cut down on the Ks since then.
His launch angle is nearly the same as Juan Sotos's. If he can make more hard contact, we may have a breakout player (no jinx). So far, Cruz has been projection plus insane feats. Hopefully, he's turning that into production.
I always liked his swing. He should hit a lot of line drives if he can make consistent contact. He's hit lasers that we're low to the ground but managed to bounce off the rightfully wall on a fly! He must put the fear of God into first- abd second-basemen.
I bet he puts the fear of God into outfielders with those low-line drives hissing at them.
Fans in the RF bleachers too!
Wonder if he would consider a long term contract this offseason? Don’t know what it would look like but he already has a major injury and he wasn’t a big bonus signing. He might be more willing than you would think
I think it's more than a coincidence that his turnaround coincided with my claim that he's my child.
Rengifo?
Jack optioned to Indy .
Wow, finally. Wonder if a trade is about to hit.
Prolly just to make room for Reynolds
So essentially a Bae for Jack swap
Bae had a really nice game - got on base twice in 4 abs, stolen base, clutch bunt hit (wow we have a player who can bunt?) and nice athleticism in right field . When he is on, he bring an energy to this team that is needed. I'd give him first shot at replacing Gonzales and then trade for two outfielders tomorrow
the drag bunt is the secret to his success
Totally agree. MAT should not see the field again as a Pirate unless it’s against a lefty or late game defensive replacement
He can pinch run as well but only late in a close or tied game lol
SMALL SAMPLE SIZE - did I say SMALL SAMPLE SIZE. Do you bench a guy on a putrid offense who in the month of July has an OPS of .837 mostly in a short side platoon? Oh... he is also by far the best defensive outfielder as a centerfielder. This is not to say MAT was a great signing or a keeper but..... he has been as playable as many in July. Pending any trade they should keep running him out there against lefties. His career says he can hit lefties at an ok rate.
First, I agree he's the teams best defensive CFer, best used in a shortside platoon, defensive replacement or pinch runner.
Second, Your SMALL SAMPLE SIZE argument is complete and total BULLSHIT!!! Take out 1 game on July 5th and his OPS is less than .500 (I'm being generous with .500). Talk about SMALL SAMPLE SIZE! I'll be fair and throw out his worst game an 0 for 4 on July 20th.
47 at bats 7 hits 0 hr 8 bb 21 k
That's a .149 batting average with .170 on base without those 4 hits, 1 was a homerun on the 5th, his slugging is less than .300. Your entire small sample size is based off one freaking game. That's 28 of his last 30 games minus his best and worst game.
First - mea culpa - you took the research on step further and you are correct. What's funny is our conclusion is similar - short side platoon / defense only and I am sure we both would like a REAL upgrade (still strongly think Pillar is not that upgrade). I'll pardon your sarcasm as just anger at the whole Pirate situation since I don't think I partake (have called out some people - well only 2 daily repeaters - a few times) in that banter. To my credit I clearly emphasized small sample size on purpose to be clear I was not predicting some grand production turn around. Go bucs... next few days will be interesting.
It's all good. In an ideal situation Taylor would be a good 4th or 5th outfielder because of his defense an base running abilities. Sadly a true upgrade is probably not happening. The best hope and I'm not counting on it is Bae and Palacios, and that's a long shot at best with neither being close to Taylor defensively.
What if they go get Ward, pillar, Diaz and Rosario? That would fill all their needs but not of these guys are real exciting. I don’t think it would take a lot to get them. They all would be upgrades.
TBH, MAT has outplayed (not by a lot) Pillar for the last 2 months. Pillar had a monster May and outside of that not much. Rosario already looked like a nice add as a backup infielder replacing Triolo before Nick was hurt, now he looks even better. Ward still just feels like Joe to me and his really bad #s since being hit in the head (I think that was the injury) really makes me hesitant to add him. Just my opinions.
If the goal is playoff success, this club needs relievers as much they they do bats.
Chafin would be my target. Dream would be bleday, rooker, Diaz and chafin.
None of those guys move the needle for me-saw Ward hit a grand slam today and that moved his OPS over .700. No thanks
There is upside with Ward. Pillar takes Taylor’s spot, Rosario takes Triolo spot and Diaz moves Hayes to the bench. All move the needle. All above league or at league average. Right now they have so many well below league average hitters. I don’t love any of these guys either but just a thought.
Josh Fleming elected free agency. Whatever.
oh no.......anyways
If Chappy is traded, we actually could need him with no other LHers in the pen. Or BC will need to get a better LHer which is always a crapshoot off the waiver wire.
Since it doesn't seem they'll be traded, we still have Gonzalez and Perez.
I'd go for the crapshoot.
5 k per 9 and 4+ walks per see ya
Booyah!!! Back on the winning side and #53 in the books. Got interesting but a win is a win Raise it!
The Dbacks know they have a closer problem. Their GM went out and got Puk. We know we have a bats problem.........??
I imagine Ben will probably order more bats.
To keep the analogy going…
The Pirates offense needs like 5 Puk’s
But Ben could give like 5 f***s.
Sorry, that last word came with several asterisks. Could you clarify?
I do believe you’re being overly dramatic for effect with these type comments. However, I also believe BC is hesitant to make a “big” move because he knows what happened to the last guy who sat in his chair after he made a “big” move.
I wish I could find the article about Ben "agonizing about every decision"
That's an indication of self doubt or procrastination with a not knowing where to start a particular task instead of laziness.
Or so I've been told lol
This team causes me to drink and smoke too much! lol.
Drinking is good for you. I use edibles. Better for the lungs.
Convince my liver
Excellent way to flush the kidneys. Just make sure you're hydrating. 😐
When I go on a bender at my age, my entire body hurts. Body aches, apathy, hangxiety. Really try to limit it to a few times per year…holidays, vacation. I’ve found an edible and a few stiff bourbons a couple evenings per week are key to a healthy lifestyle
I'm a former bartender. Have to be careful how much I bartend for myself. Like cocktails a bit too much for my own good. Particularly manhattans. Think my recipe is the closest I've come to mastery in my lifetime. What a thing to waste mastery on haha.
I go in and out of different phases…Moscow mules, old fashioned, bourbon, IPAs. Weirdly if I drink a domestic beer, it’s pbr and I’m not a hipster.
I like beer flavored beer rather than all the hoppy stuff. Lagers. PBR is fine.
Still doing cigs or the green stuff?
He’s doing the good stuff
cigs.
So tough to quit (and maybe you don't want to which is your prerogative). I finally kicked them a few years ago by looking like a moron vaping and reducing nic over about 6 months. Smoking killed both my folks though so it was worth it I guess.
Right on, man. Good on you.
I pack the zyns with all the kids. Better than mouth and throat cancer.
I've seen those floating around. Wish they were out there when I was trying to quit I think 6 years back. Apparently Tucker Carlson loves them.
Never any doubt.
That..was a game.
Broke my record for turning game off angrily. Glad I came back for the ninth.
6-4 and a long AB.. I was thinking just throw a strike, even a solo run wouldn't end the game.
Then a solo run... and a triple...
Was damn sure we'd lose, glad I'm wrong. What a game.
Ye of little faith
Honestly I have very little to no faith when it comes to the Pirates
I just "hope" for the best 😂
Wisdom
Reynolds back tomorrow?
Yes he is
That was so agonizing, but in the end we get to RTJR!!!