I keep wondering is DS stood up to BC about this, I mean BC just said days a go that OC was their SS and then this…… I wrote before about the fact that Cruz is still at SS is proof that DS is a bad manager. If he stood up to BC and made this move it changes my view a tiny, tiny bit. Completely when he stop running struggling relievers in key situations.
Was thinking the other day about the time he followed me across multiple social media to tell me he knows who I am and that he keeps trying to approach me in public before I sneak away... man what a time
For me Cruz needed to be moved off of SS, but moving him to CF. Well, that's like going from the frying pan to the fire, anybody wonder why this team keeps losing and losing and losing...Again the old adage strong up the middle just seems to escape the Pirates...
They keep losing because moves like this tend to be a last ditch effort rather than pre-planning. Can't wait till they finally decide, "Ok, Henry Davis isn't a catcher"
If there has been anything that we can say for certainty about this front office, it is that they eventually embrace reality and make decisions about what is real and not what they imagine reality to be about 3 years after reality becomes obvious to everyone else.
I was laughing to myself earlier cause for shits n gigz, I decided to look up how the Guardians were utilizing Bazzana.
Lo and behold, they *gasp* have only used him at 2B. Every single inning so far. The Pirates on the other hand, split Jebb exactly 50/50 between SS and 2B in his debut 36 games. Now, they obviously aren't near similar prospects in the grand scheme, but both are/were considered fringy defensive 2B who wouldn't play SS moving forward. Early on, and Cleveland may get him some starts after working with him a bit, but still kind of funny he hasn't even played an inning there yet.
A couple of random comments. First, the Pirates, under Cherrington have shown a complete disregard for team defense. Second, the goofing around with prospects may be (may be.... for all the lunatics on this site who have histrionic reactions to any comment that they don't like) a bunch of Jacobin stat-geeks in the front office who ignore the baseball people and spend time "accumulating data" to evaluate players who really need no data to determine where they best fit. It may also just be a general disregard for team defense.
Finally, it is obvious that Cherington has no idea how to manage a small-market team. Power is the hardest thing to acquire. You have 3 ways to do it: via free agency, via international amateur free agency, and via the draft. The Pirates cannot afford power via free agency. It is expensive. They need to focus on power bats heavily in amateur free agency and the early rounds of the draft. Getting pitching from these sources is fine too, but there needs to be power as well... not the Mitch Jebbs of the world. It is helpful to the Pirates that, because of the design of PNC, they can basically focus all their attention on left-handed power and pretty much ignore right-handed power bats.
That being said, the way to be consistently good as a small-market, especially with PNC- and its massive left field, as your home-park, is to focus on speed and defense generally. It is helpful that these 2 attributes often come together in a player. Both are cheaper than power and can be acquired more readily in later draft rounds and for cheap via international free agency.
The disregard for defense is what bugs me. You’ve either got to score runs or prevent them to win (hold for more earth shattering wisdom). But while we all know power bats and arms are hugely expensive, defense is still fairly cheap on the open market. And it’s even better if you deploy players you’ve developed in the right spot for them!
I don’t care so much about Cruz or Davis losing value as much as having them in the best spot for their success. If they had both been moved to the outfield 2-3 years ago (and the team stuck to their runs on that decision), I can’t help but think they’d be in better shape to succeed then they are now.
They just got a better-than-best-possible version of all the Mitch Jebbs they have drafted in IKF for 7-million dollars per year, well within their price range. Try finding a Pete Alonso, Rafael Devers, or Vlad Guerrero for that price. That is why they need to focus on pitching and power in amateur free agency and the early rounds of the draft. If a guy can't hit HRs, can't generate swings-and-misses, or doesn't have 3 plus pitches and a groundball profile, the Pirates should not be drafting them in rounds 1-3 or paying them more than $100K in IFA.
The TLDR version is that Ben has essentially shown he's bad at all aspects. He might be better in a complimentary role, but head manning a FO clearly isn't in his skillset, aside from what amounts to one successful season with a club that had an endless budget.
Not sure I'd put the defensive ineptitude on the nerds, I think it would be the complete opposite. Whereas the teams like Dodgers, Guardians, or Rays (VERY analytical depts.) will get players at more premier positions, knowing they can always move off whether due to a need or lack of success at said position.
It's not the ineptitude that I put on the nerds. That is a decision about priorities that anyone could make. Some teams can and should place a much lower priority on team defense, such as Boston, for example. I think that the monkeying around with positions in the minors may be an attempt to gather data about defense... data that is mostly unnecessary for anyone who has played, coached, or even observed a good amount of baseball. It is mostly just wasting time.
We all know he is not catcher, and honestly they drafted him because of the monies for later in the draft. Now what do you do with him...can he be a decent 1st baseman or DH?? outside of that were can he play? I have no idea...
It's the Pirates, so I'd be hard pressed in believing a breakout till a player has done it for at least two years, but the emergence of Joey Bart who is controlled for another 3 years should almost immediately enact plan B with Henry, which I'm sure they haven't even theorized as this juncture.
Which, I'm fully prepared to yell at the tv, or my phone, depending what I'm watching at the time, when they inevitably have Termarr play SS in Altoona
I also can't wait till Greensboro lineup comes out with shouldn't be playing SS Mitch Jebb, playing SS over Javier Rivas who they'll probably put at 3B.
That doubly proves your point, as even that indicates a lack of pre-planning. I was listening to a podcast earlier this year with Dan Szymborski, where he lambasted both the Pirates and Royals management for trying to fool around with Davis and MJ Melendez in the field. He pointed out that neither player probably hits enough to be valuable at a corner position (arguable in Davis’s case).
To jump in out of left field, a lot of the athletic's content is really good in my opinion. The roundtable is always good for laughs, rates and barrels is just eno and DVR shooting the shit related to advanced metrics and science, among others
Thanks. I’ve listened to BP a little bit, not Baseball America though. I’ll have to give that one a shot. Always looking for quality podcast content.
Also, it was that podcast. Here’s the transcript:
“And I like that the Pirates are going to be more serious about looking at him at catcher because I think what I yeah, because they have to. But you know, a lot of teams don't realize what they have to do. Like, I think the Royals with a similar situation with MJ Melendez, they don't quite realize that he's probably not a major leaguer unless he's a catcher.
So they might as well see if he could be a catcher. The Pirates. I mean, the Royals do not realize that at all.
But I think the Pirates kind of his rather poor appearance. I mean, we're talking 650 something OPS. I think it kind of made them more realistic on the possibility that saying, OK, he's not necessarily going to be an instant star as a corner outfielder.”
A+ GBO prepping for the playoffs, FCL Pirates finished second in their Playoffs, and A, AA, and AAA just playing it out. Not a real good year for the Pirate Developmental System, with AA and AAA a combined 26 games under .500. AAA has had a lot of talent all year and should have made the playoffs easily. AA has never really looked good positionally (if that's a word).
The haters said he couldn't do it.
And honestly they were right. Great call by the haters.
I keep wondering is DS stood up to BC about this, I mean BC just said days a go that OC was their SS and then this…… I wrote before about the fact that Cruz is still at SS is proof that DS is a bad manager. If he stood up to BC and made this move it changes my view a tiny, tiny bit. Completely when he stop running struggling relievers in key situations.
AM is doing MiLB coverage for DK Sports…….good for Anthony.
Tim Williams vindicated, the cabal of Nutting Plants conspiring to steal his wives and put his business under has finally shown through.
So AM was a mole all along……that’s next level sleeper cell stuff! 🤪
NMR isn't making that up.
I didn’t think he was, sad and disturbing.
Was thinking the other day about the time he followed me across multiple social media to tell me he knows who I am and that he keeps trying to approach me in public before I sneak away... man what a time
Uhhh wut? Good lord.
lol i know, right? What?!
I wish I was creative enough to make it up
That is both off the wall bananas and sad at the same time.
WTF?
For me Cruz needed to be moved off of SS, but moving him to CF. Well, that's like going from the frying pan to the fire, anybody wonder why this team keeps losing and losing and losing...Again the old adage strong up the middle just seems to escape the Pirates...
They keep losing because moves like this tend to be a last ditch effort rather than pre-planning. Can't wait till they finally decide, "Ok, Henry Davis isn't a catcher"
If there has been anything that we can say for certainty about this front office, it is that they eventually embrace reality and make decisions about what is real and not what they imagine reality to be about 3 years after reality becomes obvious to everyone else.
I was laughing to myself earlier cause for shits n gigz, I decided to look up how the Guardians were utilizing Bazzana.
Lo and behold, they *gasp* have only used him at 2B. Every single inning so far. The Pirates on the other hand, split Jebb exactly 50/50 between SS and 2B in his debut 36 games. Now, they obviously aren't near similar prospects in the grand scheme, but both are/were considered fringy defensive 2B who wouldn't play SS moving forward. Early on, and Cleveland may get him some starts after working with him a bit, but still kind of funny he hasn't even played an inning there yet.
A couple of random comments. First, the Pirates, under Cherrington have shown a complete disregard for team defense. Second, the goofing around with prospects may be (may be.... for all the lunatics on this site who have histrionic reactions to any comment that they don't like) a bunch of Jacobin stat-geeks in the front office who ignore the baseball people and spend time "accumulating data" to evaluate players who really need no data to determine where they best fit. It may also just be a general disregard for team defense.
Finally, it is obvious that Cherington has no idea how to manage a small-market team. Power is the hardest thing to acquire. You have 3 ways to do it: via free agency, via international amateur free agency, and via the draft. The Pirates cannot afford power via free agency. It is expensive. They need to focus on power bats heavily in amateur free agency and the early rounds of the draft. Getting pitching from these sources is fine too, but there needs to be power as well... not the Mitch Jebbs of the world. It is helpful to the Pirates that, because of the design of PNC, they can basically focus all their attention on left-handed power and pretty much ignore right-handed power bats.
That being said, the way to be consistently good as a small-market, especially with PNC- and its massive left field, as your home-park, is to focus on speed and defense generally. It is helpful that these 2 attributes often come together in a player. Both are cheaper than power and can be acquired more readily in later draft rounds and for cheap via international free agency.
The disregard for defense is what bugs me. You’ve either got to score runs or prevent them to win (hold for more earth shattering wisdom). But while we all know power bats and arms are hugely expensive, defense is still fairly cheap on the open market. And it’s even better if you deploy players you’ve developed in the right spot for them!
I don’t care so much about Cruz or Davis losing value as much as having them in the best spot for their success. If they had both been moved to the outfield 2-3 years ago (and the team stuck to their runs on that decision), I can’t help but think they’d be in better shape to succeed then they are now.
They just got a better-than-best-possible version of all the Mitch Jebbs they have drafted in IKF for 7-million dollars per year, well within their price range. Try finding a Pete Alonso, Rafael Devers, or Vlad Guerrero for that price. That is why they need to focus on pitching and power in amateur free agency and the early rounds of the draft. If a guy can't hit HRs, can't generate swings-and-misses, or doesn't have 3 plus pitches and a groundball profile, the Pirates should not be drafting them in rounds 1-3 or paying them more than $100K in IFA.
The TLDR version is that Ben has essentially shown he's bad at all aspects. He might be better in a complimentary role, but head manning a FO clearly isn't in his skillset, aside from what amounts to one successful season with a club that had an endless budget.
Not sure I'd put the defensive ineptitude on the nerds, I think it would be the complete opposite. Whereas the teams like Dodgers, Guardians, or Rays (VERY analytical depts.) will get players at more premier positions, knowing they can always move off whether due to a need or lack of success at said position.
It's not the ineptitude that I put on the nerds. That is a decision about priorities that anyone could make. Some teams can and should place a much lower priority on team defense, such as Boston, for example. I think that the monkeying around with positions in the minors may be an attempt to gather data about defense... data that is mostly unnecessary for anyone who has played, coached, or even observed a good amount of baseball. It is mostly just wasting time.
We all know he is not catcher, and honestly they drafted him because of the monies for later in the draft. Now what do you do with him...can he be a decent 1st baseman or DH?? outside of that were can he play? I have no idea...
It's the Pirates, so I'd be hard pressed in believing a breakout till a player has done it for at least two years, but the emergence of Joey Bart who is controlled for another 3 years should almost immediately enact plan B with Henry, which I'm sure they haven't even theorized as this juncture.
They’re probably gonna move Davis to short.
Which, I'm fully prepared to yell at the tv, or my phone, depending what I'm watching at the time, when they inevitably have Termarr play SS in Altoona
I also can't wait till Greensboro lineup comes out with shouldn't be playing SS Mitch Jebb, playing SS over Javier Rivas who they'll probably put at 3B.
Love it. Just somehow get him to about a 120 wRC+ hitter, and who cares if it works
That doubly proves your point, as even that indicates a lack of pre-planning. I was listening to a podcast earlier this year with Dan Szymborski, where he lambasted both the Pirates and Royals management for trying to fool around with Davis and MJ Melendez in the field. He pointed out that neither player probably hits enough to be valuable at a corner position (arguable in Davis’s case).
Thanks I always forget about Eno! I gotta get him into my rotation.
Also what podcast?
Don’t quote me, but looking back through my podcast listening, I believe it was NS9 on 12-19-2023.
Recommend listening to both of those podcasts if you get a chance. I often forget about FG pods cause I visit the site enough.
To jump in out of left field, a lot of the athletic's content is really good in my opinion. The roundtable is always good for laughs, rates and barrels is just eno and DVR shooting the shit related to advanced metrics and science, among others
Sweet, thanks. I often end up listening to BP (five and dive) and BA stuff a lot.
Thanks. I’ve listened to BP a little bit, not Baseball America though. I’ll have to give that one a shot. Always looking for quality podcast content.
Also, it was that podcast. Here’s the transcript:
“And I like that the Pirates are going to be more serious about looking at him at catcher because I think what I yeah, because they have to. But you know, a lot of teams don't realize what they have to do. Like, I think the Royals with a similar situation with MJ Melendez, they don't quite realize that he's probably not a major leaguer unless he's a catcher.
So they might as well see if he could be a catcher. The Pirates. I mean, the Royals do not realize that at all.
But I think the Pirates kind of his rather poor appearance. I mean, we're talking 650 something OPS. I think it kind of made them more realistic on the possibility that saying, OK, he's not necessarily going to be an instant star as a corner outfielder.”
In short, the Pirates should never be the last group to realize one of their players can’t play a position and should be moved to another position.
A+ GBO prepping for the playoffs, FCL Pirates finished second in their Playoffs, and A, AA, and AAA just playing it out. Not a real good year for the Pirate Developmental System, with AA and AAA a combined 26 games under .500. AAA has had a lot of talent all year and should have made the playoffs easily. AA has never really looked good positionally (if that's a word).