163 Comments

would Josh Bell and Starling Marte cost more than prospects like Bowen, Terrero, Priester, Tres Gonzalez?

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It depends how much salary is absorbed and in which direction.

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it just seems like those two dudes are a much more reasonable cost in prospects than Robert and Vlad

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Yeah

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plus i really like the "unfinished business" undertones to acquiring them

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Jun 6·edited Jun 6

I can see Alonzo being more realistic than Marte, as a pure rental. It's a one year expense. The competition for Alonzo will be pretty fierce, it's going to take a lot in prospect capital to get him. Marte shouldn't cost much in prospects if the pirates take on his contract but that ain't happening. It would cost a pretty good package to get him from the Mets to absorb the cash.

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How much is left on Marte’s deal? I love the idea of getting him. He’s a true pro and still a solid player. One off my favorites from the 2013-15 run.

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40 mil is a lot of money

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Marlins just ate a lot of money from Avisail Garcia

Wonder if there is a slick accounting way for the Mets to reduce their payroll tax threshhold while also paying Marte to play for us at the same time?

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Not sure

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why is Marte no longer playing center field?

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He's a step slower and like you mentioned they have Bader.

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Jun 6·edited Jun 6

maybe just because Bader wins gold gloves

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Pirates are exactly one game out of the WC race. They haven't played their best yet, multiple guys on O underperforming. They are primed for a run. Starting pitching is too good.

RELAX, fellas.

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Was just thinking yesterday with how our starting pitching is doing, we really just need either the offense or the bullpen to rebound for us to start stacking wins. Obviously would want both, but even just getting one gets us over .500 in a hurry and to stay imo

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We just played the Dodgers twice and moved up in the standings. That is something to be happy about.

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Agree, it also shows we play to the competition, we need to start winning series against everyone.

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https://blogs.fangraphs.com/the-dog-ate-my-prospect/ should be shown to Nutting as definitive evidence Cherington is terrible at his job (data from 2018 to 2023) [not that Bob gives a half a rats ass]

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I am not here to defend Cherington, but the data underlying that analysis is Fangraphs' scouting ratings, and the conclusions are based upon the assumption that Fangraphs' scouting reports are accurate. I am highly skeptical of this assumption. Most Fangraphs' stuff on 40-grade and below players comes out after they are selected and based upon some metrics and what the teams' that drafted these players project. Thus it is not clear that the problem is development and not scouting. This is the problem with amateurs presenting pseudo-scientific analysis and dressing it up with statistics: not that professional mathematicians are much better with their use of statistics in this day and age. In the old days, there was peer-review (not much use any more). Who peer-reviews the work of these guys?

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Really good post, man.

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Fangraphs (Longenhagen) is my go-to regarding prospect analysis. But they get stuff wrong as well. He was the one that said Suwinski is a DH only with 20 field and 30 speed.

There's no chance he did good faith scouting on Jack. He got bad info from a bird dog and never really clarified how he was so wrong.

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and they get stuff wrong for other teams too so it's averaged out

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What does this mean...

"Pittsburgh’s 13-place jump stems from productive seasons from Jack Suwinski, Jared Triolo, and the group’s headliner, Oneil Cruz. "

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I've never seen a miss that bad.

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Wait til you find about about this Paul Goldschmidt guy.

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Suwinski is in the 71st percentile for sprint speed and they labeled him with a 30.

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Its not perfect but it's evenly imperfect across the league in it's way. It's not a good thing to be so bad by this metric, I can assure you.

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The purpose of the article was to distinguish development from scouting, and it fails to do that convincingly. Hence, it does not pass muster. It is fair to say that the Pirates have been near the bottom of the league in graduating MLB-ready talent to the majors, as has Oakland and Colorado. We already knew this. We still don't know why. The article adds nothing to our understanding.

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Hence? Ok your “analysis” is on ignore pedant.

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What does this mean...

"Pittsburgh’s 13-place jump stems from productive seasons from Jack Suwinski, Jared Triolo, and the group’s headliner, Oneil Cruz. "

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I honestly have no idea. We look squarely bottom 4 to me when mentally combining the two tables.

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That is likely to change significantly with Jones & Skenes.

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I don't think so so much in Skenes' case since he started off as a 55 fv and is now prob maxed out as a 60. Also doesn't do much about the hitter part where they were 3rd worst.

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Skenes is now a 65

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Huh, so he is. Actually this analysis only factored 40 fv's and below so it could focus on development so Skenes doesn't factor nor does Jones.

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I’d be down for that.

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I was looking at 1B trade options and the only guy, on a team that would be willing to deal, is Josh Bell. I then took a look at Outfielders and I think Pham, Pillar, Ward, Chisom, Marte and Winker are all options. I really don’t love any of these options unless they went all in for say a Luis Roberts. I don’t think it would take much to get a Bell or say a Winker though. That improves two big holes in the lineup with guys who get on base and have power.

As far as pitching, I think they need 1 or 2 bullpen arms and there are so many out there on terrible teams. The Marlins, Nationals and Athletics is where I’d go. Maybe grab Bryan Hoeing from Marlins and Michael Kelly from Athletics.

I think if I were GM I would trade for Josh Bell and the two relievers I mentioned. I think that would fix most of the issues. I then would be hoping Gonzales keeps doing what he is, Davis figures it out along with Suwinski and hope Hayes stays healthy. I think 84-88 wins will win the division and 83+ gets a you a wild card.

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The Mets will reportedly trade Alonso to get out from under Luxury Tax issues. I believe he is in the last year of his contract. No clue how the LT thing would affect the trade price.

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This rotation is gifting Cherington with an opportunity few GMs have ever dreamed of. Anybody else would be scrambling frantically to put a decent team behind it, but five years in, we’re still waiting for a scrap of evidence that winning baseball games is on his to-do list.

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Starkey had an excellent column in the P-G today making this exact point. The Pirates have done the hardest thing in baseball and put together one of the scariest rotations in the game, basically overnight thanks to Jones and Skenes. So *there is no reason to wait for some magical future moment*. Starkey argues that this team could win a championship with this rotation if they had a better offense and more reliable middle relief.

The problem is that building a better offense is going to be extremely hard. Who is available that would really make a difference? Bell and Marte are not at that level.

Remember the Madlock trade? Even the 79 Pirates will all the talent they had needed one more push to get them over the top.

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One hidden advantage they have is that it’d be incredibly easy to upgrade from Cherington’s three abysmal lineup signings. Tellez is well below replacement. You would literally have a strong chance of upgrading by using some AAA rosters and a dartboard. Ditching him would be one of the lowest-risk moves in baseball history. Finding long term answers is much harder, but Dave Littlefield on crack could find short term upgrades, and with this rotation that could mean playoffs.

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I really like the post by JRC21 and WTM here.

All of the people dreaming about Yankees-style trades are beautiful dreamers. I have seen over my years in sports that the difference between first and last place is sometimes the flick of the switch.

Here is a good example, not from baseball: My Aston Villa were being managed by Steven Gerard (a former legendary player with Liverpool) and had the team struggling to avoid relegation. Ownership hired Unai Emery and in the space of a year he took the SAME TEAM, with the SAME PLAYERS to the top four and a place in the Champions' League.

JRC21 is right on here: "This team could win a championship with this rotation if they had a better offense and more reliable middle relief."

That's not a lot to ask. WTM calls the low bar what it is. You could take anybody off the AAA roster... probably even a pitcher if I'm exaggerating... and improve on Rowdy's production. If you just gave 1st to Connor Joe, you've done the thing and you could DFA Rowdy and find a good 2-3 inning pitcher in the meantime. It doesn't cost a lot to get a left handed ground ball pitcher who would complement this bullpen.

What I am wondering is whether or not it makes sense to let Rowdy find a hot streak to get something back at the deadline and "maximize" fungible assets. If he's fungible, then you're not gaining any ground by not eating, what? $3 mil?

Prove me wrong, BC.

But, honestly, these crazy dreams of multi-player trades of Cruz and the good pitchers coming up are, to me, just that: crazy.

The team needs a competent bat and a competent left handed middle/swing man.

______________________________

"Hey, Mac. Let me take a whack at it."

-Wabbit

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A real GM would try something like Cruz, Chandler, Suwinski and Solometo for Luis Robert and Garrett Crochet and then swing a trade for Vlad and Bichette (Peggy, Endy, Mike Burrows or maybe a bit more and you'd have to do Harrington). The second trade makes losing Cruz nbd until 2026 and gets us a 1B until then, too. Robert makes Suwinski unnecessary and you're sending him home to Chicago.

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The only GM’s who would do those deals are SD and Sea.

BN is wayyyy too risk adverse to take on those salaries. Even in the short term.

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I'd add Miami and maybe Getz in Chicago too which is an important one.

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IsIt2016Yet agrees with you on baseball trade values.....

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For a healthy Robert, I get your logic. However, he averages staying healthy for maybe a half a season. This has been going on for nearly 5 years now. He will soon be making 20 million a year which equates to 40m a year for a guy that misses half a season. I do like Cochet though. I think we are overpaying on that one.

Your second trade I think we are underpaying, but love Bichette, Vlad scares me that he could be another Prince Fielder or Pablo Sandoval as his homers have dropped from 48 to 32 to 26 to only 6 so far this year.

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I'm liking your ideas here but I think focusing on Robert would be the way to go. Thinking that Chandler, Suwinski, Peguero and a throw in would get the White sox interested.. I'd be hesitant to trade Cruz at this point knowing that his potential is still off the charts.

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I'm tired of watching Cruz play period. Not that my individual opinion matters at all but I just hate watching the kid play. Dumb player.

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It is hard sometimes to be a fan of Cruz, but the fault is not his, so far as I can see. It is how he has nailed to SS for years, when his talents better suit other positions, such as 3B or OF. OF would be a real project at this point, given his obvious difficulties with flyballs of all types.

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Jun 6·edited Jun 6

I always hated the idea of him at 1st base but if they use him as the main cut-off coming home every where except down the left field line and he can handle balls in the dirt. He's a hell of a big target.

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I always say that AJ Preller is a fan's dream.

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When you remember that baseball is a business and that keeping the fans in the seats and watching on TV should be top priorities for top-line revenue, Preller looks much better as a GM than his record would indicate.

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Guy follows nine losing seasons of completely irrelevant baseball with winning clubs in four out of the last 5 and Pirate fans call him a failure for spending too much of the owners money.

We deserve everything we get, lol.

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They seem to have infinite capacity to find and develop talent... at least to the AAAA level... sufficient to make trades. That says something about his ability to find and recruit decent coaches and scouts. Have all of his trades been great ideas? No... they are going to really feel the pain from losing Wood, I think, but at least, he has made an attempt to win.

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That's almost exactly where I fall.

I read this article from BA that said among the *66* prospects he's traded there has been exactly *1* 3-WAR season delivered from them combined.

Remarkable lesson here...

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A fantasy dream, he has wrecked San Diego, tap out budget wise and never got far in the postseason……better than this sh*tshow, but still….

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Oh relax, he hasn't "wrecked" anything.

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Not yet, he’ll be long gone before the Machado, Bogart contracts completely crippled the team.

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I give him credit for making a legit effort to compete with the LA Dollars. But I’m with you on the likelihood some of those deals are going to sour long before they’re completed.

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His rapid promotion of prospects then trading them is pretty genius. He might let a few get away but he usually gets the big name target.

He still holds on to the prospects until he sees a reason not too.

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What is your evidence that he isn’t “scrambling frantically”. It’s a long season and making a good deal takes time. If he made a big move right now it would be very unusual and likely an overpay.

You say things like this and then when he makes a “frantic” panic move like the Glasnow trade you’ll complain about that. The Pirates are in position to compete in 2024 and he has plenty of time to reinforce the team. Billy Beane said the season has three parts. Two months to see what you have, two months to get what you need, two months to blow the doors off. The second section literally just started. I guarantee he is working the phones.

Let’s wait for him to actually prove he isn’t doing that before assuming he’s resting on his laurels.

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He just said last Sunday on his radio show he'd only just begun looking at other rosters at all so Cherington makes us say he's not scrambling frantically himself.

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No sense of urgency, with the weak division the pirates are in, a very good starting rotation, an almost competent rotation of position players, a shaky bullpen and a favorable schedule going forward. 3 or 4 moves could put the team in strong position to make a playoff run. BC will probably look for a bandaid instead of stitches to fix the holes. I'm not sure he even realizes the window is a smidgen open, go get the fan and wedge that fucker open with something that adds value.

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It's hard to make a move right now, and we are still in the overpay portion of the season. The Pirates really need to acquire players with multiple years of control including pre-arb. years. The guys in this category at the positions of need are still "depth pieces" for contending teams in case of injury. They are probably going to have to get through June with what they have before thinking seriously about adding. That is why it was important to have a good off-season.

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Jun 6·edited Jun 6

Totally agree on the off-season, but if I was the GM I'd at least propose an overpay for the right deal. For example the ChiSox,

Go for a near one stop shop, if the medicals checkout. Go for Robert and Crochet maybe get Sheets as well. Offer 2 or 3 of Bae, Peguero, Priester, Olivares, Ashcraft, Suwinski or another 40 man player the pirates can afford to be without. 5 or 6 prospects with limited exceptions. 2 or 3 lottery tickets with limited exceptions. Basically an 8 for 2 or 10 for 3 package.

I'm not saying give them Priester, Ashcraft and Suwinski, plus Bubba, Harrington, Johnson, Barco, and Solometo, plus Matoma, Shim and Mueth.

More like 2 out of these 4 Priester, Ashcraft, Bubba and Harrington, 1 has to be on the 40man. 2 of Bae, Peguero or Olivares or just Suwinski. 2 of Brannigan, Johnson, Jebb or White. 1 or 2 of the '23 draft arms, depending on who they want and finally 1 or 2 of the position players in A ball or under depending on who they want.

You're right it's a tough time to make a trade but give them an offer that would be tough to turn down without giving up the farm.

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The Pirates had every opportunity this offseason to sign players and still keep their prospects. That was when it should have been done. With the current format, there really isn't a sense of urgency for most teams. The Pirates are one game out of the wild card, but they are also 2 games from having the third worst record in the National League.

If the Pirates get above .500, that is the when I think we start trading prospects.

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Totally agree on the off-season, but the starting rotation deserves more support offensively and in relief. A few good moves could make this team a contender.

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I think our bullpen would be better if we can find a way to stop throwing 5 or 6 pitchers every game. The Pirates need a couple more solid 3 inning guys, maybe instead of Heller and Nicolas. I'm hoping Borucki will be back in a few weeks. Maybe Domingo German will be ready. Josh Fleming looked good in his last few outings.

When they are not pitching back to back, I think it is better than people think. IMO, we need to change the way we use our reliever. Otherwise, they will continue to be inconsistent.

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Umm, his entire history. And Tellez’ continued presence. After five years and yet another comically bad offseason, he merits zero benefit-of-the-doubt consideration.

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It’s not benefit if the doubt to not expect panic trades in early June. And his history of not making panic trades DURING rebuild years isn’t relevant. That’s move by the goalpost.

You’re conflating all your disappointment in BC into this specific issue. He may suck, but you have no evidence he isn’t scrambling to trade now. He’s never been in this position so you cannot know how he will react.

Predictable whinging then moving the goalpost.

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I wouldn't call them panic moves if they greatly improve the teams chances of contending.

The right moves would fill PNC on a daily basis, potentially motivate the current roster, and change the organization entire atmosphere from the bad news bears "wait till next year" to the "go ahead and adjust, good luck" peak of confidence.

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I think WTM is referring to the past couple of seasons where he could have improved the team leading into '24. Of course there's not going to be June trades. Gotta believe conversations don't even happen until All Star break or after.

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Ok, yes, but what he actually said was that literally “anyone else” would be “scrambling frantically”.

Present tense.

Sure, if you read his comments over time you realize he might be extending a larger argument about previous seasons and adding onto his list of grievances against this front office.

Nevertheless, this particular grievance is nonsensical on its own.

What is difficult for readers like me who don’t post a lot of comments (or at least for me and me alone) but read the threads daily, is the overwhelming sense of entitlement to negativity some commenters seem to maintain.

Commenters acting entitled to absolutely eviscerate everything and everyone Pirates related even when we just took a series from perhaps the NLs best team.

This is a privately run blog and as long as they aren’t moderated. Suppose they are entitled, but they aren’t entitled to respect.

It’s simply not fun to see it in every single thread and when it is nonsensical I plan to call it out. No benefit of the doubt that he meant over the past years rather than presently “scrambling frantically”.

He did not say over time. And he didn’t give BC any benefit so there ya go.

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Go to Bucsdugout if you feel the need to be surrounded by positivity constantly, GreatWhiteAngus. The team is in last place for fuckssake. What do you expect?

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You go ahead and "call out" anybody criticizing the GM with the worst W/L record and worst offense in MLB since he took over. Uncle Ben will appreciate it.

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And I think that’s a perfectly valid criticism: to have improved personnel leading into 2023 and 2024.

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gotta think both Jones and Skenes are going to the allstar game for MLB marketing purposes

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The big question is with ROY, because if Skenes finishes 1st or 2nd (and who would complain if he did?), we'll lose that year of control we thought we had gained by keeping him down until May. Gotta root for Jones to finish first and Gonzales runner-up ;)

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I got my money on Yamamoto and Imanga to finish 1-2. Besides being veterans, disguised as rookies, they also play in large markets.

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I think Imanaga has had two straight rough outings--I'm hoping and expecting the league to figure him out and he'll fall out of the conversation. Lots of other good rookies, though.

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The Pirates played it as best they could with Paul Skenes without regard to ROY or any other considerations. He came out of the draft beat up after a very long college season for the National Champion (122.2 IP). Pitched 3 innings at A and 3 IP at AA in 2023, then 2024. He was given 7 starts, 27.1 IP in AAA to shake off the offseason and work on his mental approach for beginning his career in MLB. He was treated like the extremely valuable asset he is to the Pirates and the game.

Remember, there are 2 or 3 International stars who joined MLB - my favorites for 1 and 2 in the NL are Imanaga (Cubs) and Yamamoto (Dodgers). Regardless of the circumstances, I cannot see the Pirates allowing Skenes to pitch more than 130 innings Total in 2024. Jared Jones has averaged about 125 IP the last two years in the Minors, so they may allow him to go 140 this year.

If the team can play above .500 the next two months, watch for the Pirates to try to closely monitor IP for both of these kids to possibly extend their usage into the stretch run. 6 man Rotation? More BP games? I think that could be why they are closely monitoring Ashcraft's numbers, and I am anxious to see what Mike Burrows can do in July? Same with Priester. Thomas Hinson Harrington may be in the picture also - because of his late start, he only has around 25 IP so far in 2024. All of those investments and gambles in the draft are beginning to pay off. BC does not have to make calls - with the resources he is sitting on, his phone should be ringing off the hook -as they used to say in the olden days!

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any notion of Skenes being here more than 4 years is a pipe dream

just enjoy the next 3.5 years

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I am guessing Keller is a lock if he keeps pitching well. He has the counting stats with 7 wins. Skenes has an outside chance if he keeps shoving and building off his 3 W's

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If Keller keeps on like he has the last month, he should be in the conversation to start the game. He’s getting lost in the Skenes/Jones hype.

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Seems like he took off when the Skenes-Jones hype was peaking.

Keller might prefer to be in the shadows, without the pressure of being the Guy.

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So, Keller’s 1st half last year was because he was pitching in the shadow of Rich Hill?

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Austin Hedges

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Or, should we say Dick Mountain?

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I've thought that myself, better by being in the background.

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Yeah, he comes across as an introvert. Doesn't always look comfortable with cameras in his face answering questions. He's not an alpha male. Skenes & Jones are full blown alphas.

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Skenes is on the mlb.com homepage three times per week

I would be shocked if he is not on the allstar team

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Jun 6·edited Jun 6

Agreed. It's the NL manager's decision to pick pitcher's IIRC.

So stats are not the sole reason for selection. Skenes is looking like a no-brainer for MLB to have on the team. Edit: it's actually players ballot and Commissioners Office that picks the pitchers. Consider Skenes "IN"!

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Luis Robert for Bubba Chandler and Termarr Johnson. Who says no?

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It's closer than I thought. BTV has it 39.6 to 36.4 in surplus value with the Pirates overpaying +3.2. I'd try Termarr + Suwinski first to see if they'd take the hometown kid. That's a minor underpay by BTV.

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Nuttin

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pirates

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Well off to bed for me, in Singapore a sports channel, SPOTV, plays Dodger games so up early, do some work, shave, coffee, and watch 6 innings before work...such a treat, night mates👏🙏👍👍

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Wednesday, June 5

29 down. 52 to go.

Pirates win 10-6 over the Billion Dollar Dodgers (Throw money at them from the outfield bleachers, people!) in what amounted to a FUN game in Pittsburgh. They’re a half game outta last place where the suddenly hot Reds are 7-3 over their last ten, and 6.5 outta first.

CARROTS ON THE HOUSE!!!!

@> ONE carrot for Eddie O for his 2 for 2 night, 3 runs, 2 walks and 1 driven in.

@>@> TWO carrots for Nick The Stick for his 2 for 3 night, 1 run and 4 (FOUR) ribbies. I do believe Nick is gonna stick the rest of the season the way he knocks runners in. He’s quickly gaining on B.Rey.

@>@>@> THREE baby carrots for Baby Skenes whose matchup versus a powerful Dodgers lineup was just wonderful. 5 innings, 3 runs, 1 bb, 8 K, and two bombs. The three pitch blow-down of Ohtani was epic.

__________________________

“A constant menace to pilots are the Gremlins who wreck planes with their di-ah-bo-lickel sa-ba-ta-ge.”

-Wabbit

*

*

Tuesday, June 4

28 down. 53 to go.

Pirates win 1-0 in an absolute thriller over the Dodgers as J. Jones picks up the win on six shutout innings. Mike Wazowski was back in black and gold and made the difference with a bomb off Tyler (why did we ever trade you) Glasnow.

CARROTS ON THE HOUSE!!!

@> One orange and juicy root for The Bullpen. Accepting today will be the low man on the leaderboard among Holderman, Chapman and Bednar, each of whom got it done. Low man of this date is HodorMan (Hodor!), so, carrot juice for him.

*

@>@> Two carrots for Mike Wazowski for the game winning dinger. It was the ONLY ball he hit on the day as two strikeouts were in his column for the day. Hoping Waz can pull a Nick The Stick and go down and stop whiffing.

*

@>@>@> Three for Jones (“Then along came Jones…”) for six shutout innings.

One other thing I wanted to note here is that Davis looked comfortable behind the plate and went 1 for 3 with a double. So… here’s lookin’ out for a quality major league catcher down the road a piece.

___________________

“Ha. Whaddya know? Ran outta gas. You know how it is with these A-Cards.”

-Wabbit

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Solo being used as an opener again...wtf

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Richmond lineup put a whoopin on him and Harrington, yikes.

Gotta figure Solometo is close to a trip on the development list.

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Obviously, congrats to Jared Jones and Paul Skenes for getting two wins off of a very tough opponent. And, Nick Gonzales, who entered 2024 with very little value. His work at AAA led to his promotion to MLB and he has continued to hit and establish himself as a key player in the future of the Pirates. It's baseball, and I'm glad he produced that First Round caliber of play with the Pirates.

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In hindsight maybe we shouldn't have doubted Gonzales since this seems to be a repeat of his success in college (not recruited out of HS to top-10 pick) but I was among the doubters given that K rate. Love the work ethic.

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I’m always found the K rate worries to be overblown. He never was even at 30%. We have big hopes for lots of players over 35%. I know it’s the first round pedigree that made everyone nervous but that’s not rational. A player is what he is after the draft and will be what he will be. But the best part is that he actually didn’t ever “suck” in the minors. He has Always been over 120 WRC+ at every level.

Seriously, I get it. He had major flaws and couldn’t hit MLB last year but Nick the stick is a good example of expecting too much from people too fast. And BC himself may be getting similar hate right now. Maybe. He has us in position to make moves and compete in 2024. That’s kind of what the plan was. Why all the whinging.

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"We have big hopes for lots of players over 35%."

I don't tend to, though. Gonzales may help change my mind; in the past I've seen too many of our prospects with high K rates in the minors struggle in the majors. But what's hopeful about Nick is that his changes led to his AAA K rate dropping from about 27% last season to only 17% this season while still being able to drive the ball (.250 ISO) and that seems to be translating to the majors.

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Yes, 100% he needed to get the K rate down to carry over at 120+. But I expected a 100 WRC+ even if he didn’t and so did ZiPs. Or 95 anyway. Not first round awesome sauce but not a bust.

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Most encouraging, though I didn't really doubt him, is seeing Johnson rebound from his poor April. Over his last 15 games (yes, I picked a good game as the starting point ;)), he has a .982 OPS.

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When I look at hitters, whether they are power hitters or singles hitters or anything else in between, I always tend to look at that BB/K Ratio. TJ's numbers have always been close to 1/1. Right now his BA is around .205, but his OBP is up around .381 as a result of the 42 Walks he has worked. That's team ball!

Should see he, Jack Brannigan, Charles McAdoo, and possibly 1 or 2 others move up to AA shortly - listen for the pitchers at AA cheering in the background!

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Is Jase Bowen starting to figure out AA? Is he a legitimate prospect?

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Kelly doesn’t have good feel for the CH. It’s not a great pitch. Good separation but it stays straight too often and has very little fade. Every now and then he’ll snap off a gross one though.

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Tip of the cap to the players for winning last nights game, per the gameday comments there seemed to be some serious Shelton mis-management headwinds but they overcame it🙏🙏🙏👏👏👏

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My only issue last night was not sending Holderman back out for the 9th. He only faced 1 batter and now we probably don't have Holderman, Chapman or Bednar today. If Shelton does use any of them today, whoever is used probably won't be available on Friday or Saturday.

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Jun 6·edited Jun 6

Seems nitpicky, there are too many nights where I read this blog stating, just get the win, who cares about tmws game.....now its different, why did you use him?, we need him for tmws game... not you, just saying, to me reading the Shelton stuff, is tiresome, but folks enjoy, so fine👍

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I’m with Ted on this one and Melkel you are not an issue. I joined the threads later in the game and expected excitement and just too many GM sucks, Peguoro screwed etc. it’s not that they are necessarily wrong it’s just that its ground hog day for many of the type of complaints. Have a new take or angle or in some cases in game debate go for it. If it’s just another 20 year or 5 year complaint - let it rest for a day or week.

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Posters saying stuff like this - Skenes and Jones are really good, but the chances of them blowing out their arms are astronomically high. Who thinks like that?

It would be like saying - Grandma is really responding well to the chemo, but the chances of her not making it is very high.

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I know I just (mildly) criticized Ted for posting his criticism so this is a bit hypocritical, but I think we do better when we limit our criticism to the management team and players (i.e., the professionals) and not to other posters. If someone disagrees with a poster, just offer a counterargument. E.g., instead of telling someone they're "stupid" (Ted has never done that, others have), just offer evidence that contradicts their post. Instead of criticizing the poster for their opinion of one of Shelton's moves, either explain why it was a good move or give an example of another move that was smart.

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Grumpy SouthernBuc will be quiet now.

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Only thing I said last night was in response to someone else something like "Shelton has been known to be a dumbass lol"

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Yeah...i love those fly by shelton insults followed by lol

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I clearly feel Shelton is poor manager. I gave him the benefit of the doubt through 2022 as well as Cherington but neither deserve that now.

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Well, the team is in a position to add and compete so what exactly is the problem?

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Evidently, not actually "fine" if you felt the need to raise the issue.

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Is it an issue for someone to point out ongoing behaviour and then step back and realize maybe its ok? Do you not point out, constantly, "issues" followed by seeing it another way? Like your Stratton opinion below🤷‍♂️

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I didn’t notice any obvious errors by DS last night, unless you want to bitch about him using Bednar in a non-save situation.

What I did notice is Pirates hitters having a good approach w RISP for a change.

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I went back through the thread (missed the game due to being in the mountains all evening) and didn't see much criticism either other than questioning the use of Stratton, which seems fair. I think Stratton is being given too much trust, but in Shelton's defense I don't know who else you go to in that situation. After our big three, it's a roll of the dice.

Our primary need is a bat or two, but adding a reliever or two seems necessary too.

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We need a lefty badly in the pen (other than Chapman). I’m willing to get Flemmings another shot, for now.

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I'm watching the mlb highlights of the game and after hitting Paxton hard and scoring three runs with nobody out and runners on first and second Suwinski bunts, lol. I don't know why but for me it was a WTF moment!

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I was at the game. That was all Suwinski going for a hit. Shelton didn’t call that.

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I figured at that point he didn't and it looked like a drag bunt attempt for a hit. Didn't like the decision either way.

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Well keep a lookout and help the other posters point them out when they occur 🙏🙏🤣🤣

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