John likely would know more, but the most prominent guys I know of were LHP Diego Chiquillo and OF Ruben Vizcaya.
Chiquillo got $200K, but he struggled to throw strikes through four DSL seasons.
Vizcaya's from Venezuela, so his bonus was unknown. He was supposed to be a potential five-tool outfielder, along with 500 other guys each year. He didn't hit much for three years, then had a .911 OPS this year in 29 games, but after four years I guess the Pirates weren't convinced.
Hitting is both physical and mental, and he obviously is not believing in himself at the present time. Whether at AAA or MLB, somebody has to get with him off to the side and explain to him how important he is to the future of this club. 26 HR for the Pirates in MLB in 2023, and now he can’t find his ass with both hands at AAA? Somebody will get him moving in the right direction - I just hope the Pirates do not kick him to the curb.
Great site we have here...thanks BOD owners... pls error on NOT kicking off folks... my guys saying "insufferable", echoes what many think are reasonable responses🤦♂️🤣🤷♂️
P.S. ignore me, im walking and texting in Clarke Quay, SG, close to taxi stand, ill be more thoughtful tmw, if I can be more thoughtful, impossible to be less thoughtful🤣🤷♂️🤦♂️🤣
Someone mentioned it briefly in yesterday’s thread, but I don’t think it’s a coincidence that this team started to plummet in the standings whenever Nick Gonzales got hurt. This team desperately needs someone who can drive in runners on base and that’s a role he seems to have a knack for.
He’s talented, showed a knack for getting clutch hits, and has been a solid defender at 2B. He killed it at the plate in May with an OPS of .913, then the league caught up with him and his OPS dropped 275 points to .638 in June, and dropped another 105 OPS points in July where he posted a .533 OPS. His situation is going to be tenuous at best, especially with a lot of younger MI’s in the mix. Yorke is 3 years younger, Peguero 2 years younger, Johnson 5 years younger, etc. I favor Peguero because he is the insurance policy for O’Neil Cruz, and he can hit for power. I like Yorke’s bat - can we give him enough glovework to be a passable 2B? Johnson is also a strong 2B/SS and will be at AA starting in 2025. And, is Pichardo in the mix? A lot of balls in the air!
I'm not sold yet that Nicky G's timely hits weren't just coincidental...I hope not, and I think he warrants first crack at second base next year, but the general production is going to have to get better.
So losing Nicky G. was the 2024 downfall to our beloved Pirate Season🤣🤦♂️?? It sure didn't help MWT, for sure, but this lineup, with Nicky or without, wasnt prime time ready....what do I know🤷♂️🤷♂️
Not saying they were going to win the World Series or even make the playoffs, but they lost numerous close games during this slide to the bottom of the standings and Gonzales, whether you consider his hitting “lucky” or not, was a capable rbi man this season.
Whomever has been called upon to replace his production (Triolo/Bae/Williams) since he got hurt very clearly has not been as effective. They left 10 runners on base yesterday and were 0-6 with runners in scoring position. Literally one hit with runners on base would’ve turned that one game from a loss to a win.
Couple things... and this isnt my style but here I go...
> Shelton is not plus or minus WAR on our 2024 teams performance, probably even, for those wanting to hate him, go focus on Haines🤣
> difficult to read posters on this site calling us pgh men racist last night😡....Get a life and who cares where you have lived in this country or others... nobody has been further away from usa than me for 16yrs and pittsburgh is not racist, Pgh is smart and Strong💪🤝🤣...
>sorry, not my style, i hated what i read ystd, im starting to get the Aurelious and B j lo Clinton guy, atleast they dont judge me, they just hate me for knowing more than them about baseball🤣, see folks, this can be fun 👍👍🤣🤣
Regarding Shelton, this is probably correct. Generally speaking, the importance of a manager is wildly overrated, especially nowadays when they have less input into the decision making process than ever. In the grand scheme of things, the difference between a good manager and a mediocre manager might be a couple of games either way in the W-L column. As fans we like to hang on and critique every move, when the reality is, stuff like pulling a pitcher a hitter too early or a hitter too late really doesn’t make much of a difference in the aggregate. The exception to that would be someone wildly incompetent, and that generally isn’t the case, at least with field managers, because most of them are baseball people who have experience playing the game.
Yuppers, I have no allegiance to Shelton, I feel weird being the guy having to be reasonable in simply pointing out that he is not our issue, but I AM not saying he is our solution🤦♂️
Regarding Shelton, this is probably correct. Generally speaking, the importance of a manager is wildly overrated, especially nowadays when they have less input into the decision making process than ever. In the grand scheme of things, the difference between a good manager and a mediocre manager might be a couple of games either way in the W-L column. As fans we like to hang on and critique every move, when the reality is, stuff like pulling a pitcher a hitter too early or a hitter too late really doesn’t make much of a difference in the aggregate. The exception to that would be someone wildly incompetent, and that generally isn’t the case, at least with field managers, because most of them are baseball people who have experience playing the game.
>Don't like seeing all the focus on Haines when Shelton is a former batting coach and would surely sign off on everything Haines is teaching (when Haines was hired, Shelton said that they hired Haines so that everyone could be on the same page). I'm not saying they shouldn't replace Haines because they might benefit from someone who isn't on the same page, just that it's not a magic bullet that will solve all the problems. But any problems we have go deeper than the batting coach.
>Racism exists and I've experienced it (I'm not a minority but that doesn't mean I don't hear what people say or can't be attacked due to a group I associate with) and while there are places where it is more common than other places, it surely exists in Pittsburgh as it does everywhere. But absolutely Pittsburgh shouldn't be classified as a racist city (I couldn't say I love Pittsburgh if it was) and I'm sure that most (though not all) rants about a Pirate or a Steeler of color are strictly due to performance and not race. In general, I don't think certain adjectives used in sports commentary are distributed equally across different ethnic groups--why is that?
It's not for the reason I had hoped for a month ago (key battle for WC position), but the Reds series should still be interesting even if it's about 4th place in a division with only one winning team (the only division like that). In any case, lots of young talent and tonight's matchup of Skenes vs. EDLC is worth tuning in (of course I won't be due to MLB's blackout rules, but will follow online).
Also, I'll give Shelton some credit in his postgame comments by using "we" after a loss and calling out a glaring problem:
“We have to have better at-bats,” Shelton said. “We have to put the ball in play. 16 strikeouts does not give us an opportunity to score runs.”
Hopefully embedded in the "we" is that this former batting coach is accepting some responsibility...
I think that Sheltons word choice (us/we) has caused you incredible angst, i wish i could speak to him to ensure proper messaging to allow you better sleep and analysis, rested, on your judgement on his performance🤣🤣
Definitely not "incredible angst", just a bit of annoyance because it calls to mind a manager I really didn't like, Jim Tracy. In fact, I commented earlier this summer (what, you don't read and remember all my posts???) that I liked that his word usage had changed to clearly giving credit to the players for their successes (that's when he should be using "they"). I also like his rational approach to a player like BDLC noting that it wouldn't be surprising to see him pressing, and that he's stood by OC despite his issues at SS.
In general, I think Shelton is strong in clubhouse management as the players seem to sincerely like him (if their 3-13 stretch continues, though, the questions asked about whether Hurdle lost the team in '19 have to be asked about Shelton) but I think his on-field management leaves something to be desired, sometimes due to sticking too closely to a script and other times remaining too loyal to a struggling player. But overall I don't think he gives us an advantage but I also don't think he's incapable of leading a team to the postseason.
Fine, ill never understand the focus on his wording, when you even state that he is a good manager of men...i hope he, Shelton, gets fired, be fun to see how the fanbase reacts to the next guy..."dear blog, now the game is over and we lost, i felt the manager should have done this
The much bigger concern is with the FO and especially Cherington. I can see giving him one more year only because it took Huntington until year 6 to produce a playoff team. But, here in year 5 shouldn't we be better than a last place team in the weakest division with a farm system ranked in the lowest third?
I did not care for Tracy as a manager, but to his credit, he did talk pretty honestly with my buddy and me at PirateFest about the Jose Castillo vs Jose Bautista infield battle (which is quite hilarious in retrospect).
Bednar? Really? Isn't the definition of stupid doing the same dumb thing over and over. He's either injured or finished. The Bucs do have an alltime world class closer available. Why not use Chapman?
Because the GM and Manager lack the balls to make a change like Arizona did when their closer wasn't getting it done. Even Nicholas would be a better option right now. It's the difference in a winning culture and a losing culture.
Edit: they've mismanaged Bednar since the start of the season. He should have never come North after pitching so little in Spring Training. It's like they have him on a pedestal.
Is anyone able to speak about the releases of the DSL group? Anyone of note or surprise?
John likely would know more, but the most prominent guys I know of were LHP Diego Chiquillo and OF Ruben Vizcaya.
Chiquillo got $200K, but he struggled to throw strikes through four DSL seasons.
Vizcaya's from Venezuela, so his bonus was unknown. He was supposed to be a potential five-tool outfielder, along with 500 other guys each year. He didn't hit much for three years, then had a .911 OPS this year in 29 games, but after four years I guess the Pirates weren't convinced.
No shockers, no top signings.
That's John's forte. We might need to ask for an assist
Suwinski was 1 for his last 39 AAA at bats before that HR yesterday.
Do we have any historical Buccos comps for this guy? Showed some promise and then just completely and utterly ruined.
Nothing comes to mind. This is a pretty precipitous drop.
honestly what I was just thinking about.
I'm starting to think he should be a dfa candidate.
what bugs me is, like, why? how is he this bad.
Guy's still not chasing anything, he's running an 85% zone contact rate, 42% hard hit rate...and has a .152 batting average.
I'd be tempted to wake up next February pretending 2024 never happened and roll the dice.
Hitting is both physical and mental, and he obviously is not believing in himself at the present time. Whether at AAA or MLB, somebody has to get with him off to the side and explain to him how important he is to the future of this club. 26 HR for the Pirates in MLB in 2023, and now he can’t find his ass with both hands at AAA? Somebody will get him moving in the right direction - I just hope the Pirates do not kick him to the curb.
Or at least let him exhaust his last option in AAA...See if he can figure it out. That power is legit, and a nice PNC fit.
get back to a nice lil corner OF big-side platoon bat.
Great site we have here...thanks BOD owners... pls error on NOT kicking off folks... my guys saying "insufferable", echoes what many think are reasonable responses🤦♂️🤣🤷♂️
P.S. ignore me, im walking and texting in Clarke Quay, SG, close to taxi stand, ill be more thoughtful tmw, if I can be more thoughtful, impossible to be less thoughtful🤣🤷♂️🤦♂️🤣
Since im rambling tonight, let me clearly state that im tipsy, not a masculine term, but how cool can I be once married?...goodnight, best mates👍🙏
Pirates signed a low level MiL lefty, Blake Townsend.
teenage wasteland
16 comments and only about 3 are baseball comments. wtf guys?
Group therapy in here...
Secretary Catch, please allow the Minutes to reflect that NMR was not involved in this one.
Well you know that im a big NMR fan, mate... Im on record saying that "of all the posters I know, you are one of them".....its funnier in person🤷♂️🤣
No shenanigans from Mr. Ross.
Seriously
Someone mentioned it briefly in yesterday’s thread, but I don’t think it’s a coincidence that this team started to plummet in the standings whenever Nick Gonzales got hurt. This team desperately needs someone who can drive in runners on base and that’s a role he seems to have a knack for.
He’s talented, showed a knack for getting clutch hits, and has been a solid defender at 2B. He killed it at the plate in May with an OPS of .913, then the league caught up with him and his OPS dropped 275 points to .638 in June, and dropped another 105 OPS points in July where he posted a .533 OPS. His situation is going to be tenuous at best, especially with a lot of younger MI’s in the mix. Yorke is 3 years younger, Peguero 2 years younger, Johnson 5 years younger, etc. I favor Peguero because he is the insurance policy for O’Neil Cruz, and he can hit for power. I like Yorke’s bat - can we give him enough glovework to be a passable 2B? Johnson is also a strong 2B/SS and will be at AA starting in 2025. And, is Pichardo in the mix? A lot of balls in the air!
I'm not sold yet that Nicky G's timely hits weren't just coincidental...I hope not, and I think he warrants first crack at second base next year, but the general production is going to have to get better.
So losing Nicky G. was the 2024 downfall to our beloved Pirate Season🤣🤦♂️?? It sure didn't help MWT, for sure, but this lineup, with Nicky or without, wasnt prime time ready....what do I know🤷♂️🤷♂️
Not saying they were going to win the World Series or even make the playoffs, but they lost numerous close games during this slide to the bottom of the standings and Gonzales, whether you consider his hitting “lucky” or not, was a capable rbi man this season.
Whomever has been called upon to replace his production (Triolo/Bae/Williams) since he got hurt very clearly has not been as effective. They left 10 runners on base yesterday and were 0-6 with runners in scoring position. Literally one hit with runners on base would’ve turned that one game from a loss to a win.
Got an opportunity to at least ruin Cincy fans weekend
Man, I did not know Will Bednar was struggling like this.
Couple things... and this isnt my style but here I go...
> Shelton is not plus or minus WAR on our 2024 teams performance, probably even, for those wanting to hate him, go focus on Haines🤣
> difficult to read posters on this site calling us pgh men racist last night😡....Get a life and who cares where you have lived in this country or others... nobody has been further away from usa than me for 16yrs and pittsburgh is not racist, Pgh is smart and Strong💪🤝🤣...
>sorry, not my style, i hated what i read ystd, im starting to get the Aurelious and B j lo Clinton guy, atleast they dont judge me, they just hate me for knowing more than them about baseball🤣, see folks, this can be fun 👍👍🤣🤣
Regarding Shelton, this is probably correct. Generally speaking, the importance of a manager is wildly overrated, especially nowadays when they have less input into the decision making process than ever. In the grand scheme of things, the difference between a good manager and a mediocre manager might be a couple of games either way in the W-L column. As fans we like to hang on and critique every move, when the reality is, stuff like pulling a pitcher a hitter too early or a hitter too late really doesn’t make much of a difference in the aggregate. The exception to that would be someone wildly incompetent, and that generally isn’t the case, at least with field managers, because most of them are baseball people who have experience playing the game.
I’m not sure which manager said it, but it was simple in its eloquence: You can’t make chicken salad out of chicken shit.
Yuppers, I have no allegiance to Shelton, I feel weird being the guy having to be reasonable in simply pointing out that he is not our issue, but I AM not saying he is our solution🤦♂️
Regarding Shelton, this is probably correct. Generally speaking, the importance of a manager is wildly overrated, especially nowadays when they have less input into the decision making process than ever. In the grand scheme of things, the difference between a good manager and a mediocre manager might be a couple of games either way in the W-L column. As fans we like to hang on and critique every move, when the reality is, stuff like pulling a pitcher a hitter too early or a hitter too late really doesn’t make much of a difference in the aggregate. The exception to that would be someone wildly incompetent, and that generally isn’t the case, at least with field managers, because most of them are baseball people who have experience playing the game.
>Agree on Shelton.
>Don't like seeing all the focus on Haines when Shelton is a former batting coach and would surely sign off on everything Haines is teaching (when Haines was hired, Shelton said that they hired Haines so that everyone could be on the same page). I'm not saying they shouldn't replace Haines because they might benefit from someone who isn't on the same page, just that it's not a magic bullet that will solve all the problems. But any problems we have go deeper than the batting coach.
>Racism exists and I've experienced it (I'm not a minority but that doesn't mean I don't hear what people say or can't be attacked due to a group I associate with) and while there are places where it is more common than other places, it surely exists in Pittsburgh as it does everywhere. But absolutely Pittsburgh shouldn't be classified as a racist city (I couldn't say I love Pittsburgh if it was) and I'm sure that most (though not all) rants about a Pirate or a Steeler of color are strictly due to performance and not race. In general, I don't think certain adjectives used in sports commentary are distributed equally across different ethnic groups--why is that?
It's time, TNBucs to focus less on Pirate hitters, more about Steeler WR room, kidding🤣🤣
It's not for the reason I had hoped for a month ago (key battle for WC position), but the Reds series should still be interesting even if it's about 4th place in a division with only one winning team (the only division like that). In any case, lots of young talent and tonight's matchup of Skenes vs. EDLC is worth tuning in (of course I won't be due to MLB's blackout rules, but will follow online).
Also, I'll give Shelton some credit in his postgame comments by using "we" after a loss and calling out a glaring problem:
“We have to have better at-bats,” Shelton said. “We have to put the ball in play. 16 strikeouts does not give us an opportunity to score runs.”
Hopefully embedded in the "we" is that this former batting coach is accepting some responsibility...
I think that Sheltons word choice (us/we) has caused you incredible angst, i wish i could speak to him to ensure proper messaging to allow you better sleep and analysis, rested, on your judgement on his performance🤣🤣
Definitely not "incredible angst", just a bit of annoyance because it calls to mind a manager I really didn't like, Jim Tracy. In fact, I commented earlier this summer (what, you don't read and remember all my posts???) that I liked that his word usage had changed to clearly giving credit to the players for their successes (that's when he should be using "they"). I also like his rational approach to a player like BDLC noting that it wouldn't be surprising to see him pressing, and that he's stood by OC despite his issues at SS.
In general, I think Shelton is strong in clubhouse management as the players seem to sincerely like him (if their 3-13 stretch continues, though, the questions asked about whether Hurdle lost the team in '19 have to be asked about Shelton) but I think his on-field management leaves something to be desired, sometimes due to sticking too closely to a script and other times remaining too loyal to a struggling player. But overall I don't think he gives us an advantage but I also don't think he's incapable of leading a team to the postseason.
Fine, ill never understand the focus on his wording, when you even state that he is a good manager of men...i hope he, Shelton, gets fired, be fun to see how the fanbase reacts to the next guy..."dear blog, now the game is over and we lost, i felt the manager should have done this
Instead"🤔🤔
The much bigger concern is with the FO and especially Cherington. I can see giving him one more year only because it took Huntington until year 6 to produce a playoff team. But, here in year 5 shouldn't we be better than a last place team in the weakest division with a farm system ranked in the lowest third?
I did not care for Tracy as a manager, but to his credit, he did talk pretty honestly with my buddy and me at PirateFest about the Jose Castillo vs Jose Bautista infield battle (which is quite hilarious in retrospect).
You aren’t the only one who has gotten Tracy vibes at times from him.
Bednar? Really? Isn't the definition of stupid doing the same dumb thing over and over. He's either injured or finished. The Bucs do have an alltime world class closer available. Why not use Chapman?
Because the GM and Manager lack the balls to make a change like Arizona did when their closer wasn't getting it done. Even Nicholas would be a better option right now. It's the difference in a winning culture and a losing culture.
Edit: they've mismanaged Bednar since the start of the season. He should have never come North after pitching so little in Spring Training. It's like they have him on a pedestal.
I picture Bednar more on a bed of fries than a pedestal.