Shelton has made no sense handling the pitching so far today especially with Harrington. Why would you bring in a minor league pitcher when decisions need to be made on the staff. And then bring Harrington back in foe 3 pitches?
Saturday he stated several players who gave already Veen sent down? Does this make sense to anyone else?
A couple of years back, the Pirates experimented at the beginning of the season with how they used their bullpen. They brought Bednar in to face the heart of the order in late-game situations rather than using him as a "closer" in the 9th inning. They then used lesser relievers against the bottom of the lineup. It paid off in spades. After a series against the Cubs, in which they took 3 of 4 (they won 3 close games and suffered a blowout loss) and evened their record at .500, then they abandoned the strategy inexplicably and proceeded to go 54 and 92 for the rest of the season.
Nothing they do makes sense, and even when they do something that makes sense and works, they abandon it.
I really don’t understand why small market clubs don’t reply their BP this way. They (should) never spend top $ on a closer and should not be concerned with a given player’s desire to rack up saves (they won’t extend elite bullpen pieces). So, why not strategically use your best arms at the right time?
Most teams do this type of thing in the postseason now, so they all know that this is optimal bullpen useage. The only reason that they do not do it in the regular season is because most MLB managers are too meat-headed to manage a bullpen like this over an entire season. Shelton heads the list of meat heads.
I think during the regular season virtually every manager feels the need to adhere to the “my closer pitches the 9th” mentality because its necessary to keep and recruit the top closers. Saves pay on FA and arbitration.
The meat heads adhere to this policy in the postseason.
I think they try to simplify things as much as possible in part because managing a bullpen like this requires a lot of thought and planning so that a couple of options are available every night. Mostly though I think it is to avoid having to take responsibility. If the manager had 4 different guys to choose from to pitch the 9th, depending upon circumstance, batters, bench, and so forth, he could be criticized for a bad choice. If he has a "closer," two "set up guys," middle relief guys, then they are solely responsble for everything that goes wrong and not the manager.
This is it. The more you have a set rotation, the less accountability there is for the manager when things go wrong. “We followed our set pattern and it didn’t work out, so we live to fight another day.”
That is exactly correct, and they think that this rotation is so strong that it can carry a mediocre bullpen and bad lineup to the playoffs. That is strong delusion.
Yes. Seems to me that this bodes well for Jones' prognosis. They seem to prefer a short-term solution, which seems to indicate that Jones should be back in about 4-6 weeks. Hard to tell with the Pirates though, so much of what they do makes so little sense.
Not sure I’d infer all that with regards to Mlod getting the nod. Could be they want to keep Harrington (and others) as AAA depth while also keeping an additional out-of-options bullpen arm to start the season while Carmen gets a shot. If he fails, they move him to the pen and waive the least productive BP arm.
Or, could mean something entirely different! Who knows with this group.
Strzelecki id imagine. Depending on the Jones news, that’d be a roster spot too.
Yea I woulda liked to see Harrington instead, but Pirates looking like they want to maintain as much depth as possible for now. Between that and Nicolas getting sent down
Strzelecki and Wentz are both out of options, so putting somebody on the 60-day won't help with them. Same with Lawrence. Rainey, whom they really ought to keep, may have an opt out. Can't remember what Ethan said about him.
Just checked. Ethan said they have until May 1 with Rainey.
I think going with Endy is the right move. After all, the definition of insanity is running the same lineup out there and expecting different results. Shameful GMing this offseason. Puts a lot of pressure on Hague for guys to improve from '24. That's a huge ask.
It seems like it’s down to this. News of Endy playing some 1B gives Bae the slight advantage. For all those who say “spring stats don’t matter, I present Ji-hwan Bae. Stats don’t matter for some guys but they do for others.
Do we think it is as simple as Borucki for Wentz? It would be a shame because Wentz has done nothing but pitch well for us since we acquired him, but I can’t see us running out 4 lefties in the pen.
Years ago, I read a study by Elias sports showing a direct correlation between spring training records and regular season records. Since then, it has borne out pretty accurately. Unfortunately, probability has a terrible correlation to reality when it comes to the Pirates who are always the exception that disproves the role.
Bae also gives the IF/OF possibility and the possible LH hitting leadoff guy, etc. And, he's been with this club for years. Perfect 26th man for a team that has not done a lot trying to improve over past years. Getting Endy and Hayes back, Bart hitting with confidence, Jack finding himself, Triolo a different hitter, and Cruz, Reynolds, and Cutch doing their thing, who knows?
Endy should have put on that 1st baseman's glove a month ago when Horwitz was injured. We don't have money and we compound that with a lack of intelligent strategy.
I’m actually excited they found a way to get Endy some more at bats. I’m very interested to watch his bat, as I know that’s been a bit of a polarizing subject, as some don’t think the bat plays at another position. I personally haven’t seen him play enough beyond his 2023 cameo to make any kind of judgment, and I don’t think it’s fair to judge him on his first exposure to major league pitching, particularly when he’s learning to catch at the major league level, which is super challenging.
Agree it’ll be moot in a few weeks, as it should be. But, in the meantime why not give the guy some extra at bats if you can? He was a pretty big prospect and I’m excited to see him after the year layoff. It’s not like Stewart or Darick Hall offered guaranteed production that would exceed what Endy could do?
I think they acted on their strategy. Endy - your job is to win the backup catchers job. That is your route to the roster because if you don't hit enough to be the backup catcher you certainly aren't a candidate to play first. Good news - he seems to have crushed it. Given the players who had trials at first base from Yorke to Frazier, the good news with Endy is he has played there before. Keep in mind, once Horowitz is back (early May at the latest?) there won't be ABs for a lefty hitting first baseman so this is very temporary which is why he should have been fully focused on winning the catching spot. By all accounts Endy is an outstanding athlete and while he may be slightly rusty, him getting up to speed to play some 1B doesn't seem all that risky. Net: I don't like their strategy in many instances but IMO this was not a terrible strategy decision with Endy.
If you put Bart at 1B, you keep Endy at C more often where his glove plays better than Bart's and Bart's bat should play at 1B. Makes too much sense for the Pirates though... so go with the lesser glove at C and the lesser bat at 1B. The Pirate way.
Every foul pop between first and catcher we hold our breath. Skenes can catch correct? What could go wrong with that? Seriously for 3-4 weeks (Horwitz out), I don't mind Endy playing some first but risk noted.
You just can't carry 3 Cs and a DH-only player on a modern 26-man roster. You only have 13 position players, and that only leaves 2 open roster spots for backups at 7 other positions.
If they had to do that I would say Delay just because I feel it spreads ABs to thin among the catching crew. But honestly I am not overly concerned about that injury scenario. Same scenario can play out if they pinch run for Bart etc. or there is a same day injury. There are many games each year where there is not a catcher on the bench for most teams and how often is an emergency catcher called upon?. Somebody is the emergency catcher and to me it is a wasted roster spot for a 'just in very unlikely scenario' situation.
He was working at 1B during Spring Training, but was told to concentrate his efforts on Catching only - I would guess that came directly from Shelton. He was a C, 2B, OF when we traded for him as part of the Musgrove trade in 2021. In 2021 at A, he played 18 games at 1B, 54 at C, and 8 in the OF. In 2022, he played in A+/AA/AAA - 18 games at 2B, 75 at C, 3 at 1B. In 2023 in AAA/MLB he played 104 games at C/10 games at 1B.
I listed the experience he has had with the Pirates just to show that we bought into this kid being able to play C/1B/2B/OF and then in 2025 ST we reverse ourselves? Maybe they were concerned that too much work on the arm could be a negative. Yes, he is a primary Catcher, but to get the bat in the order he does not have to be a DH - he is able to cover those other positions. It's a plus for the Pirates.
Shelton has made no sense handling the pitching so far today especially with Harrington. Why would you bring in a minor league pitcher when decisions need to be made on the staff. And then bring Harrington back in foe 3 pitches?
Saturday he stated several players who gave already Veen sent down? Does this make sense to anyone else?
A couple of years back, the Pirates experimented at the beginning of the season with how they used their bullpen. They brought Bednar in to face the heart of the order in late-game situations rather than using him as a "closer" in the 9th inning. They then used lesser relievers against the bottom of the lineup. It paid off in spades. After a series against the Cubs, in which they took 3 of 4 (they won 3 close games and suffered a blowout loss) and evened their record at .500, then they abandoned the strategy inexplicably and proceeded to go 54 and 92 for the rest of the season.
Nothing they do makes sense, and even when they do something that makes sense and works, they abandon it.
I really don’t understand why small market clubs don’t reply their BP this way. They (should) never spend top $ on a closer and should not be concerned with a given player’s desire to rack up saves (they won’t extend elite bullpen pieces). So, why not strategically use your best arms at the right time?
Most teams do this type of thing in the postseason now, so they all know that this is optimal bullpen useage. The only reason that they do not do it in the regular season is because most MLB managers are too meat-headed to manage a bullpen like this over an entire season. Shelton heads the list of meat heads.
I think during the regular season virtually every manager feels the need to adhere to the “my closer pitches the 9th” mentality because its necessary to keep and recruit the top closers. Saves pay on FA and arbitration.
The meat heads adhere to this policy in the postseason.
I think they try to simplify things as much as possible in part because managing a bullpen like this requires a lot of thought and planning so that a couple of options are available every night. Mostly though I think it is to avoid having to take responsibility. If the manager had 4 different guys to choose from to pitch the 9th, depending upon circumstance, batters, bench, and so forth, he could be criticized for a bad choice. If he has a "closer," two "set up guys," middle relief guys, then they are solely responsble for everything that goes wrong and not the manager.
This is it. The more you have a set rotation, the less accountability there is for the manager when things go wrong. “We followed our set pattern and it didn’t work out, so we live to fight another day.”
I dont like Mlod as the 5th starter
Is it too harsh to think that we have a rotation of the best pitcher in baseball, a solid #3, and three #5's?
That is exactly correct, and they think that this rotation is so strong that it can carry a mediocre bullpen and bad lineup to the playoffs. That is strong delusion.
For opening day, not at all. Bubba could be a second 3 or better, but losing jones immediately takes a lot of ceiling out of the group
It is a very Piratey thing to do. Take a guy who has found a niche and is having success in one role and convert him to another
A few minor league assignments:
The Pirates assigned Carlson Reed to Altoona, which is good news.
They also assigned Reinold Navarro, one of their better lower level pitching prospects, and the mysterious Carl Calixte to the FCL.
Not sure why they'd make just a few assignments right now. Probably some technicality with the roster rules or something.
I like Reed going to Altoona, haven't heard much about how he has done this spring. Getting promoted is a positive.
May mean something, may not, but Bae is in the lineup today. Stewart is not.
They just said on Twitter Stewart isn’t making the team. Borucki is
Harrington isn’t either
Shame about Harrington, but that's just too bold for BC. With Ferguson back to one-inning outings, I guess that makes Mlod a starter.
With Borucki on, gonna have to be some reliever DFAs. I'd rather keep Wentz than Mayza.
And . . . Mlod is officially the 5th starter.
was hoping it was good news with Jones
Yes. Seems to me that this bodes well for Jones' prognosis. They seem to prefer a short-term solution, which seems to indicate that Jones should be back in about 4-6 weeks. Hard to tell with the Pirates though, so much of what they do makes so little sense.
Not sure I’d infer all that with regards to Mlod getting the nod. Could be they want to keep Harrington (and others) as AAA depth while also keeping an additional out-of-options bullpen arm to start the season while Carmen gets a shot. If he fails, they move him to the pen and waive the least productive BP arm.
Or, could mean something entirely different! Who knows with this group.
I'll say . . . .
I feel like even with Jones out there are better options. Mlod was never super effective as a SP.
Strzelecki id imagine. Depending on the Jones news, that’d be a roster spot too.
Yea I woulda liked to see Harrington instead, but Pirates looking like they want to maintain as much depth as possible for now. Between that and Nicolas getting sent down
Strzelecki and Wentz are both out of options, so putting somebody on the 60-day won't help with them. Same with Lawrence. Rainey, whom they really ought to keep, may have an opt out. Can't remember what Ethan said about him.
Just checked. Ethan said they have until May 1 with Rainey.
I think going with Endy is the right move. After all, the definition of insanity is running the same lineup out there and expecting different results. Shameful GMing this offseason. Puts a lot of pressure on Hague for guys to improve from '24. That's a huge ask.
3 more days and shit gets real!
The last 10 days before OD are always the longest.
tied closely with the remainder of the season AFTER the first 10 days
Bench battles. Original. Now.
11. Endy Rodriguez…90%…100%
12. Jack Suwinski…..60%…100%
13. Ji-hwan Bae………10%…..60%
———————————————————-
14. D.J. Stewart………..5%…..40%
It seems like it’s down to this. News of Endy playing some 1B gives Bae the slight advantage. For all those who say “spring stats don’t matter, I present Ji-hwan Bae. Stats don’t matter for some guys but they do for others.
You appear to be correct. Per Stumpf, Stewart didn’t make the cut. Borucki made the rooster though.
Do we think it is as simple as Borucki for Wentz? It would be a shame because Wentz has done nothing but pitch well for us since we acquired him, but I can’t see us running out 4 lefties in the pen.
Years ago, I read a study by Elias sports showing a direct correlation between spring training records and regular season records. Since then, it has borne out pretty accurately. Unfortunately, probability has a terrible correlation to reality when it comes to the Pirates who are always the exception that disproves the role.
Well then we better win today.
Bae also gives the IF/OF possibility and the possible LH hitting leadoff guy, etc. And, he's been with this club for years. Perfect 26th man for a team that has not done a lot trying to improve over past years. Getting Endy and Hayes back, Bart hitting with confidence, Jack finding himself, Triolo a different hitter, and Cruz, Reynolds, and Cutch doing their thing, who knows?
confused me with frazier
I like this post.
Endy should have put on that 1st baseman's glove a month ago when Horwitz was injured. We don't have money and we compound that with a lack of intelligent strategy.
I’m actually excited they found a way to get Endy some more at bats. I’m very interested to watch his bat, as I know that’s been a bit of a polarizing subject, as some don’t think the bat plays at another position. I personally haven’t seen him play enough beyond his 2023 cameo to make any kind of judgment, and I don’t think it’s fair to judge him on his first exposure to major league pitching, particularly when he’s learning to catch at the major league level, which is super challenging.
This would only make sense if they were still rebuilding. I thought we were done with that phase.
If they're worried about getting him ABs, send him to AAA & he and Henry can rotate between C & DH.
I want players in positions that give the team the best chance to win, and I don't think Endy at 1b gives us that chance.
It'll be moot in a few weeks when Horwitz returns.
Agree it’ll be moot in a few weeks, as it should be. But, in the meantime why not give the guy some extra at bats if you can? He was a pretty big prospect and I’m excited to see him after the year layoff. It’s not like Stewart or Darick Hall offered guaranteed production that would exceed what Endy could do?
to me, it's too much like tryouts at the MLB level.
Who are you claiming is a demonstrably better offensive option right now?
Come on dude.
I don't know and that's part of the problem. I see Endy as a switch-hitting version of Benito Santiago. I wouldn't move him around.
I can see how you’d look at it that way.
I think they acted on their strategy. Endy - your job is to win the backup catchers job. That is your route to the roster because if you don't hit enough to be the backup catcher you certainly aren't a candidate to play first. Good news - he seems to have crushed it. Given the players who had trials at first base from Yorke to Frazier, the good news with Endy is he has played there before. Keep in mind, once Horowitz is back (early May at the latest?) there won't be ABs for a lefty hitting first baseman so this is very temporary which is why he should have been fully focused on winning the catching spot. By all accounts Endy is an outstanding athlete and while he may be slightly rusty, him getting up to speed to play some 1B doesn't seem all that risky. Net: I don't like their strategy in many instances but IMO this was not a terrible strategy decision with Endy.
You know Endy and Bart are gonna get hurt in the same game playing different positions, right?
you need to stop that
They need to stop playing people out of position.
Yeah, Endy doesn't have nearly the bat to play the position.
If you put Bart at 1B, you keep Endy at C more often where his glove plays better than Bart's and Bart's bat should play at 1B. Makes too much sense for the Pirates though... so go with the lesser glove at C and the lesser bat at 1B. The Pirate way.
Well, if you count hitter as a position, they'll have a lineup of about four guys.
Hitter as a position is DH. Love Cutch more than any player I've watched, but I hope this is his swan song. It's time to move on after this season.
Every foul pop between first and catcher we hold our breath. Skenes can catch correct? What could go wrong with that? Seriously for 3-4 weeks (Horwitz out), I don't mind Endy playing some first but risk noted.
To me, that’s more of a reason to have Delay or Tank on the big league roster. Tank more likely.
You just can't carry 3 Cs and a DH-only player on a modern 26-man roster. You only have 13 position players, and that only leaves 2 open roster spots for backups at 7 other positions.
I mean yeah, you have to save room for eleventy pitchers.
especially with Cutch needing a rest, tank could be getting his major league at bats at DH
If they had to do that I would say Delay just because I feel it spreads ABs to thin among the catching crew. But honestly I am not overly concerned about that injury scenario. Same scenario can play out if they pinch run for Bart etc. or there is a same day injury. There are many games each year where there is not a catcher on the bench for most teams and how often is an emergency catcher called upon?. Somebody is the emergency catcher and to me it is a wasted roster spot for a 'just in very unlikely scenario' situation.
Sweet Cheesus I’m not carrying a toothpick bat just because 2 catchers could run into each other on a slapstick play. Altoona is a 90 minute drive.
He was working at 1B during Spring Training, but was told to concentrate his efforts on Catching only - I would guess that came directly from Shelton. He was a C, 2B, OF when we traded for him as part of the Musgrove trade in 2021. In 2021 at A, he played 18 games at 1B, 54 at C, and 8 in the OF. In 2022, he played in A+/AA/AAA - 18 games at 2B, 75 at C, 3 at 1B. In 2023 in AAA/MLB he played 104 games at C/10 games at 1B.
I listed the experience he has had with the Pirates just to show that we bought into this kid being able to play C/1B/2B/OF and then in 2025 ST we reverse ourselves? Maybe they were concerned that too much work on the arm could be a negative. Yes, he is a primary Catcher, but to get the bat in the order he does not have to be a DH - he is able to cover those other positions. It's a plus for the Pirates.