Is anybody still watching? I would ask how many they'd have to lose in a row to put Shelton or BC in jeopardy of being fired but then I would be ignoring the "no accountability" business model of the owner. Too bad other owners and local businessmen couldn't shame the owner enough to sell. This isn't about the "poor Pirates" anymore - they would make a lot more money as winners and investment in the team could be recouped.
“I mean, today's the first game during this streak where I don't think we played well at all. We've had games where we've been close. I think the most important thing is that this group has to stay together. They've played good baseball for three and a half months. They've gotta stay together."
I always thought one of a manager's primary responsibilities is to ensure that the team stays together (Derek, it's not "they" but "we").
Good catch and good point. When things go this bad, somebody should be held accountable! Somebody needs to be fired. We know it is not going to be Cherrington, and we should know by now that we need to change the culture of this team. Shelton to the street, Don Kelly as the interim Manager and go from there.
Last year, at the 120 game mark, the Pirates had a record of 54-66; this year we are now 56-64.
Jesus, I accidentally missed this one! What's the max the skid can go with this team? 15? I'm guessing Skenes isn't going to lose 3 in a row but maybe with this run support and defense even he could.
It's a nice fantasy, but I'm convinced they're running the team exactly the way Nuttin wants. I don't think there's any level of on-field awful that'll get anybody fired.
I'll say it again: Trade Keller this winter. He'll get it back together before the end of the season, and he will fetch a legit bat which this team desperately needs. Then roll with the depth they have in their young starters. This season is over. Rotate some of the young pitching prospects and give them a major league start or two. Now it's all about 2025.
I don't think a hitting coach makes a huge difference, but our best hope for a good offense is that someone can replace Haines and impact just about every position player on the roster.
Short of that, we don't have the assets to trade for a bat without creating another hole so the hope would be that Bob will spend on an impact bat in free agency. But I've been waiting on that for however long it's been since Bob took control.
They are going to need to be creative to add bats. They need to dump hayes somehow, move Cruz off of shortstop,........I'm not against moving Keller if they can get a solid bat in return. Hopefully he can turn it around and finish strong to build back that trade value.
It's the Pirates way.......or the way of all teams that have owners that could care less about winning. Even with this free fall, I would imagine Old Bob will make a sweet profit again this year. He wins every year while the team and fans lose.
He made a 68 million dollar profit last year. I would imagine with attendance up and Skenes merchandise selling that he will easily make a profit this year.
Nutting gives him a budget. Nutting sets limits on what Cherrington can do. Another winter of mindless dumpster diving will send me off. I believe Cherrington is trying because he had options before he signed on with the Pirates. He chose this. So, he was deluded and is playing out the string or he will step up this winter -- assuming Nutting doesn't fire him.
Cherington chose the Pirates because he knew there'd never be any pressure or accountability. That's why he fled Boston. I'm sure everybody in baseball knows by now that Nuttin doesn't care what happens on the field. Cherington chose job security. I know there's a widespread assumption that Nuttin somehow broke his word about letting Cherington spend money at some point. I don't believe that at all. Cherington's running the team exactly the way he expected to be running it from the day he was hired.
MLBPA is suing Pirates and Sheetz for unauthorized use of player images in ads. Nuttin may be on the hook for some damages. Love to be on the jury. Have to use all the zeroes.
Well Keller & Reynolds salaries go up next year so I could see one of them getting traded for lottery pick, $1000 in sheetz gift cards and a player no be named later
I haven't seen or listened to a pirates game since they blew the lead against ARI on 8-4. Fearing I was the jinx, I turned on today's game, heard the first 3 padres batters, and turned it off. Baseball will break your heart.
That should be it for Joe. Not that I expected Bucs to pull this game out, but bases load, bottom 9th, caught looking on a pitch solidly over the plate? That's inexcusable.
I think we all know that Skenes will have to be limited at some point. If he stayed on the same pace of remaining starts and average innings pitched, he would throw 50+ more innings than last year. That won't happen. They could easily do a six-man rotation in September to ease his work.
The reason I mention that is because the Pirates end the season at Yankee Stadium. I have to imagine that he would love to pitch there because it's Yankee Stadium. If the Pirates shut him down early, they will take away that chance. However, if they go to a six-man rotation, he won't make a home start during the final two weeks of the season AND be able to do Yankee Stadium. You would think the Pirates would prefer an extra Skenes date at home.
Just putting a thought out there because I'm interested to see how they handle it.
he’s getting there, fastball velo is there but not as effective. He’d be the guy I’d want to see there, just not sure if he’ll be ready for that by then
It would need to be a meaningful game for Yankees, and it may not be. They've got WC clinched, they would need to still be playing for the division and a bye.
I think if they want to get him that opportunity to pitch at Yankee Stadium, then they will have the rotation set up for it well ahead of time. I don't know what Skenes thinks about Yankee Stadium, but it has to right near to top of places he would love to play. Fenway, Wrigley, Dodger Stadium and Yankee Stadium all have that appeal for most players
I don't think the game itself is the important factor when possibly getting a chance to play at Yankee Stadium. He won't get it next year during the regular season.
I don't have that same feeling that Yankee Stadium is all that special. Skenes thrives on competition. Yanks could be resting Soto, Judge, Stanton, etc. I'd not pitch Skenes in that scenario......but that's just my take.
I don't have it either because I don't think it should carry over from the original Yankee Stadium, but players coming up know the new stadium. Skenes was six when the new stadium opened. That's all he knows.
Keller seems to have fallen apart or has his frustration with lack of hitting support gotten to him? I guess Skenes now realizes that if he wants to win a game pitching for the pirates he has to give up no more than one run and even doing that he has a 50/50 chance of winning.
He kinda reminds me of Gorski with a better swing (still not a good swing). Hope he can make enough contact to be interesting. I really only watched his 2023 highlights so I have no clue what he can be.
Another obvious problem with the roster, a perpetual problem.....Padres 4th OFer (Peralta) hits 3 Hrs in 6 game series w Pirates. Our 4th OFer is Bae or Joe or Taylor (we have many 4th OFers).....with virtually no production.
David Peralta has a .737 OPS in 158 PA’s and right now would be arguably our second best outfielder. He was signed as a *minor league free agent.* Money helps folks, but there’s talent out there for cheap… we just aren’t finding it.
Yep, it's more we have one outfielder (Reynolds) and the rest are 4th or 5th outfielders that hit like minor leaguers, not even sure they're all quadA guys if not in a platoon.
Is anybody still watching? I would ask how many they'd have to lose in a row to put Shelton or BC in jeopardy of being fired but then I would be ignoring the "no accountability" business model of the owner. Too bad other owners and local businessmen couldn't shame the owner enough to sell. This isn't about the "poor Pirates" anymore - they would make a lot more money as winners and investment in the team could be recouped.
I did not have arguing with bipolar van down by the river Tim Williams on my dancecard today.
5.55% odds at winning the lotto
Shelton's take:
“I mean, today's the first game during this streak where I don't think we played well at all. We've had games where we've been close. I think the most important thing is that this group has to stay together. They've played good baseball for three and a half months. They've gotta stay together."
I always thought one of a manager's primary responsibilities is to ensure that the team stays together (Derek, it's not "they" but "we").
Good catch and good point. When things go this bad, somebody should be held accountable! Somebody needs to be fired. We know it is not going to be Cherrington, and we should know by now that we need to change the culture of this team. Shelton to the street, Don Kelly as the interim Manager and go from there.
Last year, at the 120 game mark, the Pirates had a record of 54-66; this year we are now 56-64.
No no no, Derek has the credit card and they are the folks he's ordering Dairy Queen for!
The Reds swept the Cards and have caught them in the standings--the two Ohio River teams are going in opposite directions.
Huh valuable down the stretch time for the young Reds instead of whatever the f it is our shitty team is doing.
Jesus, I accidentally missed this one! What's the max the skid can go with this team? 15? I'm guessing Skenes isn't going to lose 3 in a row but maybe with this run support and defense even he could.
Seattle has their top guys pitching this weekend, and with the way the offense has been, that could get ugly.
Good at this point. Let it burn. Take Shelton and Cherington in the flames.
It's a nice fantasy, but I'm convinced they're running the team exactly the way Nuttin wants. I don't think there's any level of on-field awful that'll get anybody fired.
Condemn the fucking team and take it away. The politicos could not possibly do any worse.
Hope. Change. Joy.
I'll say it again: Trade Keller this winter. He'll get it back together before the end of the season, and he will fetch a legit bat which this team desperately needs. Then roll with the depth they have in their young starters. This season is over. Rotate some of the young pitching prospects and give them a major league start or two. Now it's all about 2025.
I don't think a hitting coach makes a huge difference, but our best hope for a good offense is that someone can replace Haines and impact just about every position player on the roster.
Short of that, we don't have the assets to trade for a bat without creating another hole so the hope would be that Bob will spend on an impact bat in free agency. But I've been waiting on that for however long it's been since Bob took control.
They are going to need to be creative to add bats. They need to dump hayes somehow, move Cruz off of shortstop,........I'm not against moving Keller if they can get a solid bat in return. Hopefully he can turn it around and finish strong to build back that trade value.
And next year it will be about 2026 and so on and so on.
It's the Pirates way.......or the way of all teams that have owners that could care less about winning. Even with this free fall, I would imagine Old Bob will make a sweet profit again this year. He wins every year while the team and fans lose.
He made a 68 million dollar profit last year. I would imagine with attendance up and Skenes merchandise selling that he will easily make a profit this year.
That’s probably EBITDA, not profit. I’d be surprised if they made even half of that.
$75M probably
It's always been about 2025. That's why I pitched a trade with the O's. Let's hope Keller rebounds from this stretch.
Anybody who thinks BC is suddenly going to start trying to win games next year is delusional.
Nutting gives him a budget. Nutting sets limits on what Cherrington can do. Another winter of mindless dumpster diving will send me off. I believe Cherrington is trying because he had options before he signed on with the Pirates. He chose this. So, he was deluded and is playing out the string or he will step up this winter -- assuming Nutting doesn't fire him.
Cherington chose the Pirates because he knew there'd never be any pressure or accountability. That's why he fled Boston. I'm sure everybody in baseball knows by now that Nuttin doesn't care what happens on the field. Cherington chose job security. I know there's a widespread assumption that Nuttin somehow broke his word about letting Cherington spend money at some point. I don't believe that at all. Cherington's running the team exactly the way he expected to be running it from the day he was hired.
You may be right. If you are, Cherrington is as big a knave as Littlefield.
Cherington's much, much worse.
MLBPA is suing Pirates and Sheetz for unauthorized use of player images in ads. Nuttin may be on the hook for some damages. Love to be on the jury. Have to use all the zeroes.
Wow--partnering with Sheetz was cited (by Nutting) as a big accomplishment by Williams, but maybe he didn't even get that right.
Welp, who's Bob going to order Cherington to cut or trade to balance those costs?
Well Keller & Reynolds salaries go up next year so I could see one of them getting traded for lottery pick, $1000 in sheetz gift cards and a player no be named later
I haven't seen or listened to a pirates game since they blew the lead against ARI on 8-4. Fearing I was the jinx, I turned on today's game, heard the first 3 padres batters, and turned it off. Baseball will break your heart.
That should be it for Joe. Not that I expected Bucs to pull this game out, but bases load, bottom 9th, caught looking on a pitch solidly over the plate? That's inexcusable.
Andy Haines says you don’t understand hitting.
The strikeout machine continues!
I think we all know that Skenes will have to be limited at some point. If he stayed on the same pace of remaining starts and average innings pitched, he would throw 50+ more innings than last year. That won't happen. They could easily do a six-man rotation in September to ease his work.
The reason I mention that is because the Pirates end the season at Yankee Stadium. I have to imagine that he would love to pitch there because it's Yankee Stadium. If the Pirates shut him down early, they will take away that chance. However, if they go to a six-man rotation, he won't make a home start during the final two weeks of the season AND be able to do Yankee Stadium. You would think the Pirates would prefer an extra Skenes date at home.
Just putting a thought out there because I'm interested to see how they handle it.
As long as the sixth man in that rotation isn’t Luis Cessa, go for it lol
Hey, did you hack Ben’s emails?!
Don’t need to, he’s so predictable lol
Burrows should join the Pirates, but it's probably not a guarantee
he’s getting there, fastball velo is there but not as effective. He’d be the guy I’d want to see there, just not sure if he’ll be ready for that by then
It would need to be a meaningful game for Yankees, and it may not be. They've got WC clinched, they would need to still be playing for the division and a bye.
I think if they want to get him that opportunity to pitch at Yankee Stadium, then they will have the rotation set up for it well ahead of time. I don't know what Skenes thinks about Yankee Stadium, but it has to right near to top of places he would love to play. Fenway, Wrigley, Dodger Stadium and Yankee Stadium all have that appeal for most players
I don't think the game itself is the important factor when possibly getting a chance to play at Yankee Stadium. He won't get it next year during the regular season.
He'll get all the chances he needs to pitch at Yankee stadium when he becomes a Yankee in 4-5 years.
The Angels only play there once a year, so not really
I don't have that same feeling that Yankee Stadium is all that special. Skenes thrives on competition. Yanks could be resting Soto, Judge, Stanton, etc. I'd not pitch Skenes in that scenario......but that's just my take.
I don't have it either because I don't think it should carry over from the original Yankee Stadium, but players coming up know the new stadium. Skenes was six when the new stadium opened. That's all he knows.
If I were an MLB pitcher, I'd want to pitch in pitcher's parks ;-)
Keller seems to have fallen apart or has his frustration with lack of hitting support gotten to him? I guess Skenes now realizes that if he wants to win a game pitching for the pirates he has to give up no more than one run and even doing that he has a 50/50 chance of winning.
Today’s distractive note: Andrew Patrick is starting in CF for Bradenton.
He kinda reminds me of Gorski with a better swing (still not a good swing). Hope he can make enough contact to be interesting. I really only watched his 2023 highlights so I have no clue what he can be.
Well, this should be streaming. Michael Kennedy pitching. Berg, Severino and Yordany in lineup.
I feel for Reynolds, couldn't Shelton at least put Bart behind him in the lineup.
Another obvious problem with the roster, a perpetual problem.....Padres 4th OFer (Peralta) hits 3 Hrs in 6 game series w Pirates. Our 4th OFer is Bae or Joe or Taylor (we have many 4th OFers).....with virtually no production.
David Peralta has a .737 OPS in 158 PA’s and right now would be arguably our second best outfielder. He was signed as a *minor league free agent.* Money helps folks, but there’s talent out there for cheap… we just aren’t finding it.
Yep, it's more we have one outfielder (Reynolds) and the rest are 4th or 5th outfielders that hit like minor leaguers, not even sure they're all quadA guys if not in a platoon.
When did Potash come back?
He never left. He's been on and off all season.