There's really nobody who can "improve" a team like Ben Cherington. The Pirates' biggest need last offseason was hitting, so he came up with guys who now have wRC+ figures of 61, 45 and 28. They needed a catcher and got Grandal, whose slapstick performance today just added to the legend -- he combines the bat of Austin Hedges with the glove of Ryan Doumit. And now bumbling Ben's two latest bullpen additions have combined for an ERA of 41.73. How does he do it?
I don't agree, but even if this is true, it hardly absolves Cherington. Any argument that the people under Cherington are to blame for things is an argument against, not for, Cherington.
I don't like Cherington but there were the DK rumors that Shelton was essentially throwing games by playing crappy relievers Cherington stuck him with for too many PAs, etc.
One or both of those guys are gone this offseason imo. Mostly likely Shelton.
Even if we were to trust DK (I don't), it's kind of hard to even throw games when the entire roster is such trash. I think even too much emphasis is placed on the bullpen. Ben essentially signed just as useless position players, but this time signed more expensive with recognizable names worthless.
"Throw" is probably an exaggeration. I think it was "you're sticking me with this guy; I'll leave him out there 3 innings". I agree; way too much of the roster is trash. We're probably 2-3 competent relievers, 1SP and 2 actually good position players away from being competitive.
I don’t blame Cherington nearly as much as a blame the coaching, fwiw. Davis was expected to take a step forward and be the starting catcher, he hasn’t. At the very least, Suwinski and Taylor were expected to produce how they did last year, they haven’t. The biggest knock in the offseason from the offensive perspective was Rowdy, who obviously hasn’t panned out…
I was personally was fine with the pitching moves made in the offseason. As anyone could’ve predicted, Marco Gonzales got hurt. Perez was fine before he got hurt. Unexpected lengthy injuries to Moreta/Borucki obviously hurt the bullpen depth. I guess you could argue more depth to stash in AAA should’ve been acquired, which I agree with.
No players available at this point of the season are going to be any good.
Your last sentence is demonstrably untrue. Texas, for instance, totally remade their bullpen in-season last year and won it all. Teams call players up from AAA all the time, but it's not a viable option for the Pirates because Cherington's done such a dismal job with the farm system. Take a look at the Indy and Altoona rosters. They're nearly devoid of prospects and the veteran pitchers Cherington brought in as depth have been awful across the board.
And who hired those coaches?
Also, Perez' ERA was 4.71 when he went out. He wasn't pitching well, which has been a pattern for him after the early season.
This is a point I've made a handful of times on the bird app and don't think it's said enough. Especially for a mouthpiece that has been touting "acquiring and developing depth" since he arrived, this upper levels are horrendous.
They just had to backfill Indy with players from Altoona, that probably shouldn't even be starting in Altoona. They just acquired like 4 players to fill a lineup/rotation in Indy. Indy and Altoona are awful. It's so rough to watch. Especially for the interesting pitchers, they have some of the most inept fielders behind them.
I know I for one was beginning to sound alarms last year when they were calling up all the hitting prospects. I kept saying, "these guys better work, or they're screwed". And here they are with only Nicky stepping forward, and then Jack going backwards.
Texas acquired Aroldis Chapman at the end of June last season, but I would argue the bulk of their remade bullpen last season was after they acquired two ace starters (and Chris Stratton) at the trade deadline, bumping their less effective starters to the bullpen..
The reality is, as it stands right now, any team that thinks they have a shot at the post season is not going to sell off pieces yet. Hence lack of decent options to upgrade areas of weakness.
I agree with you 100% regarding the farm system, but the point I was making was the players currently on the roster who have succeeded at the major league level in the recent past are completely lost. To me, that’s a coaching issue.
Goodman was hitting worse than Davis before this game. We need to trade Henry so he can face some Pirates pitching. They should probably build some sort of booster into fWAR for being a Pirates hitter and not getting to face Pirates pitching.
Man feeling for Jones in that interview. He's really down.
Yasmani Grandal's interviews creep me the F out
That Shelton interview was hilarious.
There's really nobody who can "improve" a team like Ben Cherington. The Pirates' biggest need last offseason was hitting, so he came up with guys who now have wRC+ figures of 61, 45 and 28. They needed a catcher and got Grandal, whose slapstick performance today just added to the legend -- he combines the bat of Austin Hedges with the glove of Ryan Doumit. And now bumbling Ben's two latest bullpen additions have combined for an ERA of 41.73. How does he do it?
I think Shelton and Cherington are 1000% out of sync, honestly, and Cherington is too much of a wimp to fire Shelton.
I don't agree, but even if this is true, it hardly absolves Cherington. Any argument that the people under Cherington are to blame for things is an argument against, not for, Cherington.
I don't like Cherington but there were the DK rumors that Shelton was essentially throwing games by playing crappy relievers Cherington stuck him with for too many PAs, etc.
One or both of those guys are gone this offseason imo. Mostly likely Shelton.
Even if we were to trust DK (I don't), it's kind of hard to even throw games when the entire roster is such trash. I think even too much emphasis is placed on the bullpen. Ben essentially signed just as useless position players, but this time signed more expensive with recognizable names worthless.
"Throw" is probably an exaggeration. I think it was "you're sticking me with this guy; I'll leave him out there 3 innings". I agree; way too much of the roster is trash. We're probably 2-3 competent relievers, 1SP and 2 actually good position players away from being competitive.
That fact is independent of the hitting acquisitions, tho.
Sure it's a mess.
At least the Los Angeles Dollars had a pricey pitcher go down tonight
think its time for Nick to get some reps at third base so Hayes can platoon with Peguero
The good news is the bullpen is probably the easiest area to upgrade at the trade deadline
The bad news is we have to rely on this bullpen to keep us in the playoff hunt until then
Playoffs?! They're 7.5 games back and in last place.
Not that far back of the wild card. Still very early though, of course…
Yeah, color me skeptical lol
A few more of Cherington's "upgrades" and they could still lose 100.
I don’t blame Cherington nearly as much as a blame the coaching, fwiw. Davis was expected to take a step forward and be the starting catcher, he hasn’t. At the very least, Suwinski and Taylor were expected to produce how they did last year, they haven’t. The biggest knock in the offseason from the offensive perspective was Rowdy, who obviously hasn’t panned out…
I was personally was fine with the pitching moves made in the offseason. As anyone could’ve predicted, Marco Gonzales got hurt. Perez was fine before he got hurt. Unexpected lengthy injuries to Moreta/Borucki obviously hurt the bullpen depth. I guess you could argue more depth to stash in AAA should’ve been acquired, which I agree with.
No players available at this point of the season are going to be any good.
Your last sentence is demonstrably untrue. Texas, for instance, totally remade their bullpen in-season last year and won it all. Teams call players up from AAA all the time, but it's not a viable option for the Pirates because Cherington's done such a dismal job with the farm system. Take a look at the Indy and Altoona rosters. They're nearly devoid of prospects and the veteran pitchers Cherington brought in as depth have been awful across the board.
And who hired those coaches?
Also, Perez' ERA was 4.71 when he went out. He wasn't pitching well, which has been a pattern for him after the early season.
This is a point I've made a handful of times on the bird app and don't think it's said enough. Especially for a mouthpiece that has been touting "acquiring and developing depth" since he arrived, this upper levels are horrendous.
They just had to backfill Indy with players from Altoona, that probably shouldn't even be starting in Altoona. They just acquired like 4 players to fill a lineup/rotation in Indy. Indy and Altoona are awful. It's so rough to watch. Especially for the interesting pitchers, they have some of the most inept fielders behind them.
I know I for one was beginning to sound alarms last year when they were calling up all the hitting prospects. I kept saying, "these guys better work, or they're screwed". And here they are with only Nicky stepping forward, and then Jack going backwards.
Texas acquired Aroldis Chapman at the end of June last season, but I would argue the bulk of their remade bullpen last season was after they acquired two ace starters (and Chris Stratton) at the trade deadline, bumping their less effective starters to the bullpen..
The reality is, as it stands right now, any team that thinks they have a shot at the post season is not going to sell off pieces yet. Hence lack of decent options to upgrade areas of weakness.
I agree with you 100% regarding the farm system, but the point I was making was the players currently on the roster who have succeeded at the major league level in the recent past are completely lost. To me, that’s a coaching issue.
would be a pleasant turn of events to see Delay stay and bat .270 for the rest of the year
BC is building quite the bullpen.
If we are throwing Dalton Jeffries tomorrow there is no way the Pirates win tomorrow
It's rare you see a pitcher who did significantly better in the hitter-friendly PCL than the Int'l League. Maybe he knows how to pitch at altitude?
Oy. Our mop up guys got mopped up. Brutal.
Our annual 20 run shitshow!
Man, Joe has become nearly unplayable the last month. 63 wRC+. Guy always starts hot and turns into a pumpkin.
and there are three other guys playing in this game with worse than that
interesting to see Tellez is the opposite
check his July, Aug and September career ops
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/split.fcgi?id=tellero01&year=Career&t=b
he's a veritable Adam LaRoche!
this
i like how beeks hides the ball
Goodman was hitting worse than Davis before this game. We need to trade Henry so he can face some Pirates pitching. They should probably build some sort of booster into fWAR for being a Pirates hitter and not getting to face Pirates pitching.
half the league has worse pitching than the Bucs
Not after tonight
so, 40%.
I'm going to guess our worst guys are worse than most teams. Bullpen will be bottom third after tonight for sure.
Maybe bottom 5 after that Grand Salami haha
crimany