Part of me thinks they're going to just showcase Chandler, Ashcraft and Harrington this year and let the roster ride and then hope no one meets CWS price for Robert this trade deadline or someone like that and try and swing a trade in the offseason. Maybe they get a Taylor Ward at the deadline. 3 seasons of Robert with 2 seasons of Ward with hopefully a Kurtz lining up with at least one of those seasons along with Skenes, Jones, Keller and _maybe_ a Termarr. So are they kicking the can to 2026? Then they'd have that swing with probably one more year of Skenes in 2027 before they "have to" trade him thanks to the new ROY rule.
If I were to make this position group better without giving up too much, I would get Taylor Ward and Brendan Rodgers. If I really wanted to win I’d go for Winker too. Ward, Winker and Rodgers would force Suwinski or Palacios, Taylor and Triolo off the roster.
Lineup
1. Cutch DH
2. Reynolds CF (don’t love this)
3. Cruz SS
4. Tellez 1B
5. Ward RF
6. Winker LF
7. Gonzales 2B
8. Bart C
9. Hayes 3B
Bench
C Davis
OF Palacios or Suwinski
1B/OF Joe
IF Rodgers
This lengthens the lineup and gives them two more power guys in the middle of the lineup as well as giving them a flexible bench defender who can at least hit for league average.
The same players are being constantly shuffled in new patterns with each mock draft. It seems there’s very little certainty beyond the Reds going for Condon if the Guardians don’t pick him. Both have Kurtz being chosen before the Pirates pick.
I think I like Moore, Rainer, Yesavage and even Honeycutt (at 75% of slot) more than Tibbs. I just don't like his defensive abilities at pick 9. They can get a very similar skill set at pick 37 or 47 in Burke.
Would skenes say no to 10 years $300M? I’m thinking that’s where I’d start this off-season. Get him locked up, have him and Reynolds be your face if the franchise for the next 7-10 years. Start to build a winner in Pittsburgh. We are all dying for it!
That's probably the plan next deadline (trading Keller for a bat) when their offense falls flat on it's face again because they did quantity over quality FA in the offseason again.
Do your years count this year, and that he'll likely earn a full year of service this year? Also, I think the two option years (which I think he'd likely consider given that he'll still be young when he reaches FA) need to be in the 35-40MM range.
Following 6 years at $15 mil each (or frontload it a bit)
His next 2 years pre-arb even with the new incentives he'd only make $6 mil max. Arb1 between $15 and $20 mil, Arb2 between $25 and $30 mil
Arb3 $35 and $40 if he continually pitches at the same pace he has in his first 11 starts. So at his max performance to date it should be close to what he would make. The amount up front more than covers the lower amount in the free agent year 6, ($40+ mil by the end of year 2 compared to $6 mil).
The years would start next, bonus would be in play as soon as he signed. Basically just buying the 7th year back. You're probably right on the 35-40MM but I'd start with 30 but would go to 35-40.
Oh I’m all in on Skenes in his prime. It’s Mitch in his 30s who’s gotta go. Better to rip the bandaid while you can still use him to find a bat to support the young arms.
That's some sound reasoning, I think you need to sign Skenes before you can trade Keller though. Trading him before might make Skenes question signing.
If Nutting is willing to shell out the money, I think Skenes will get a deal similar to this but he is prob the last extension they give out that pays real money to a player for years.
It’s a shame if he is not able to lock these guys up (as long as their play warrants it) for at a minimum of 2 years past arbitration. If the Pirates can start a real core of above average/ superstar players on very reasonable contracts, then how can anyone support the team by going to games and buying merchandise if players like this aren’t signed. It just feels a little different this time with some of these young guys performing compared to 2013-2016.
It will be interesting to see if Cruz steps up and becomes a big time player if the Pirates would try to lock him up if the Hundo boys leave town.
Was at the game today. Special to see Skenes up front and personal. What a performance from the best pitcher in baseball. Obviously great to win as well!
I saw him pitch in Chicago when he was consistently throwing over 100 mph. I am fine with the stricter pitch count. Skenes was not even throwing hard today. He should have been rewarded with more pitches, imo.
If he was throwing max effort today and throwing 3 mph less, than you are correct. My thought is Skenes is smart enough not to throw max effort, unless he has to. That way he can go deeper into games and it protects his arm.
For me, it's Bob Gibson, Tom Seaver, The Unit, Martinez, Clemens, Schezer and Skenes if Skenes remains healthy and has a long career. Nolan Ryan was a freak of nature and unique. He's in a class byhimself.That bunch were power pitchers. So, I compared like to like.
To be fair, Nolan Ryan had 113 starts prior to the 73 season (39 starts that season as well) in which he accomplished the 6 inning 11 K's 0 hits twice in a season. Skenes has 11 starts total.
A second almost no hitter by Skenes this year. Yet some national journalist pinheads doubt whether Skenes deserves to start the All Star Game. Has he earned it? Have they earned the opportunity to be taken seriously as journalists?
Part of me thinks they're going to just showcase Chandler, Ashcraft and Harrington this year and let the roster ride and then hope no one meets CWS price for Robert this trade deadline or someone like that and try and swing a trade in the offseason. Maybe they get a Taylor Ward at the deadline. 3 seasons of Robert with 2 seasons of Ward with hopefully a Kurtz lining up with at least one of those seasons along with Skenes, Jones, Keller and _maybe_ a Termarr. So are they kicking the can to 2026? Then they'd have that swing with probably one more year of Skenes in 2027 before they "have to" trade him thanks to the new ROY rule.
If I were to make this position group better without giving up too much, I would get Taylor Ward and Brendan Rodgers. If I really wanted to win I’d go for Winker too. Ward, Winker and Rodgers would force Suwinski or Palacios, Taylor and Triolo off the roster.
Lineup
1. Cutch DH
2. Reynolds CF (don’t love this)
3. Cruz SS
4. Tellez 1B
5. Ward RF
6. Winker LF
7. Gonzales 2B
8. Bart C
9. Hayes 3B
Bench
C Davis
OF Palacios or Suwinski
1B/OF Joe
IF Rodgers
This lengthens the lineup and gives them two more power guys in the middle of the lineup as well as giving them a flexible bench defender who can at least hit for league average.
Today’s mock drafts:
MLB Pipeline: Tibbs
Keith Law: Montgomery
The same players are being constantly shuffled in new patterns with each mock draft. It seems there’s very little certainty beyond the Reds going for Condon if the Guardians don’t pick him. Both have Kurtz being chosen before the Pirates pick.
Fangraphs: Kurtz
Kurtz or Tibbs are fine by me.
No pitchers
No prep position players
IMO, Tibbs would epitomize an overdraft selection at 9. I would go best player available, and he just isn’t that player in any scenario.
They can't pass on Kurtz or Montgomery or even Griffen. Only reason to grab Tibbs is if he goes underslot to enhance a selection or two later on.
I think I like Moore, Rainer, Yesavage and even Honeycutt (at 75% of slot) more than Tibbs. I just don't like his defensive abilities at pick 9. They can get a very similar skill set at pick 37 or 47 in Burke.
Sucks there’s no replay on FSP…
All I have is this - Skenes game score 87!
I believe the replay is on at 11 pm the Indians were supposed to be on playing Columbus but it was rained out
His game scores are going to start looking like Oneil's EVs.
Would skenes say no to 10 years $300M? I’m thinking that’s where I’d start this off-season. Get him locked up, have him and Reynolds be your face if the franchise for the next 7-10 years. Start to build a winner in Pittsburgh. We are all dying for it!
Regardless of extension, he’s gonna be a $20m guy in arbitration at the same time they’re committed to paying Mitch Keller nearly as much.
There’s also some kid named Jones and Oneil Cruz to pay arbitration over the same period.
The writing is on the wall, we just haven’t come to terms with it.
They are going to have to start spending if they want to compete. If Keller is stopping you from signing skenes then trade Keller.
"if they want to compete"
The elephant in the room, isn't it?
Bingo!
That's probably the plan next deadline (trading Keller for a bat) when their offense falls flat on it's face again because they did quantity over quality FA in the offseason again.
I think you're right but I'd try for an extension, something like
6 years for a $100 million
$10 million of it a signing bonus
2 year option $30 million each
$8 million buyout ($4 mil each)
Total contract
8 years $160 million ($20 mil a year)
6 years $108 million ($18 mil a year)
Do your years count this year, and that he'll likely earn a full year of service this year? Also, I think the two option years (which I think he'd likely consider given that he'll still be young when he reaches FA) need to be in the 35-40MM range.
I didn't put the logic into my first response.
I'd try to sign him asap.
$10 mil immediately
Following 6 years at $15 mil each (or frontload it a bit)
His next 2 years pre-arb even with the new incentives he'd only make $6 mil max. Arb1 between $15 and $20 mil, Arb2 between $25 and $30 mil
Arb3 $35 and $40 if he continually pitches at the same pace he has in his first 11 starts. So at his max performance to date it should be close to what he would make. The amount up front more than covers the lower amount in the free agent year 6, ($40+ mil by the end of year 2 compared to $6 mil).
The years would start next, bonus would be in play as soon as he signed. Basically just buying the 7th year back. You're probably right on the 35-40MM but I'd start with 30 but would go to 35-40.
Oh I’m all in on Skenes in his prime. It’s Mitch in his 30s who’s gotta go. Better to rip the bandaid while you can still use him to find a bat to support the young arms.
That's some sound reasoning, I think you need to sign Skenes before you can trade Keller though. Trading him before might make Skenes question signing.
If Nutting is willing to shell out the money, I think Skenes will get a deal similar to this but he is prob the last extension they give out that pays real money to a player for years.
Yep, I'd try Jones as well at something like.
6 years at $60 million
$12 million signing bonus
2 year $20 million each
Buyout $3 million each year
Total contract
8 year $100 million ($12.5)
6 year $66 million ($11)
Probably not in Bob's long-term plans.
It’s a shame if he is not able to lock these guys up (as long as their play warrants it) for at a minimum of 2 years past arbitration. If the Pirates can start a real core of above average/ superstar players on very reasonable contracts, then how can anyone support the team by going to games and buying merchandise if players like this aren’t signed. It just feels a little different this time with some of these young guys performing compared to 2013-2016.
It will be interesting to see if Cruz steps up and becomes a big time player if the Pirates would try to lock him up if the Hundo boys leave town.
Just our luck, we face Crochet tomorrow. Shelty hasn't named our starter yet.
Have Ortiz and Keller over the weekend, so at least 2 of 3 looks good.
Just by chance will be in house tomorrow to bring in a win!
You got this man
Does it matter? It could be some guy with a 7+ ERA and they’d still need a shutout to win.
Skenes made us all forget we scored exactly 1 run in the last 19 innings of this series ; and still managed somehow to win it
THAT is this FO’s strategy for winning
This guy Skenes. Jeez m crow. At 63 pitches after 3 and throws 36 over the next 4?!? Unbelievable how he pitches. A ton of fun to watch
Was at the game today. Special to see Skenes up front and personal. What a performance from the best pitcher in baseball. Obviously great to win as well!
Me too! 3rd time I've seen him. A monster.
Who wants to argue about pitch count strategy!
Skenes shouldn't be on a 100 +/- pitch count. His count should be 120 +/- pitches. He's 20% more than human. Maybe more?
I saw him pitch in Chicago when he was consistently throwing over 100 mph. I am fine with the stricter pitch count. Skenes was not even throwing hard today. He should have been rewarded with more pitches, imo.
Wouldn’t that be a yellow or red flag?
If he was throwing max effort today and throwing 3 mph less, than you are correct. My thought is Skenes is smart enough not to throw max effort, unless he has to. That way he can go deeper into games and it protects his arm.
I think so too
Since we’re going into the all star break, I would have liked to see Shelton let him go for it. At least to start the 8th
I would have for sure if they lost :)
Pretty sure after the shit Skenes pulled today, he'll be starting the ASG.
Even if you just look at it from a marketing perspective, even Manfred isn't that dumb, is he?
He may be!
Paul Skenes is what a generational talent looks like.
Been saying it since May of 2023!
Team Skenes for the win (so far)
Nolan Ryan and Paul Skenes. That’s the Club.
What! A! Stud!
For me, it's Bob Gibson, Tom Seaver, The Unit, Martinez, Clemens, Schezer and Skenes if Skenes remains healthy and has a long career. Nolan Ryan was a freak of nature and unique. He's in a class byhimself.That bunch were power pitchers. So, I compared like to like.
Gooden before he discovered cocaine is the closest thing to Ryan I ever saw. But even he didn’t match Ryan and Skenes.
I hate the the Mets so much I tend to forget some of their players.
To be fair, Nolan Ryan had 113 starts prior to the 73 season (39 starts that season as well) in which he accomplished the 6 inning 11 K's 0 hits twice in a season. Skenes has 11 starts total.
To be fair, Ryan never had a Splinker.
Ryan only needed two pitches because they were just flat untouchable at times.
Someone remind me why the hell I ever wanted them to draft Crews over PS?
That was me too.
PiTcHeRs ArE ToO RiSkY
But, but, DINGERZ!
Also, could you imagine the outcry from yinzers if BC had passed on him?
The Nats fans so thought they had him, oh'well.
Damn shame.
Only your therapist can help you answer that one.
A second almost no hitter by Skenes this year. Yet some national journalist pinheads doubt whether Skenes deserves to start the All Star Game. Has he earned it? Have they earned the opportunity to be taken seriously as journalists?
Anyone who cried about how we should have drafted Crews left here? What a stud Skenes already is. May win rookie of the year and cy young.
Doc Don. Although he’s been quiet on the topic this season!
Yeah but if they were REALLY smart they would've cut a deal so they could overpay a bunch of high school kids. ;)
Booyah!! #45 in the books with Skenes getting the win. When was the last series that we won against Milwaukee in Milwaukee?? Raise it!!!!!!!