I see Jones taking the Oviedo heavy slider approach in able to succeed at least for now. The fastball lacks command, both curve and change needs refinement. I’m not sure if more time in AAA is the better place for his development.
I think Pirates keep Jones on OD roster and start him in one of the games in Miami. Big ballpark vs a mediocre lineup seems like a good recipe for his first MLB start.
The ideal would be to start Jones in the majors but send him down for a few weeks when others (Skenes, German, Lauer) are ready to both save innings (he's never pitched through September) and service time. But of course he could pitch so well that sending him down wouldn't be an option if they wanted to maintain any credibility about prioritizing winning in '24. More likely, though, is he'll experience some struggles due to command and they'll be justified in sending him down.
This is obviously the conundrum the FO faces. I don’t think anyone would disagree that Skenes and Jones are currently two of their five best starters. However, both guys have major boxes to check before a full time promotion. Not saying development cannot continue at the big league level, but it doesn’t serve either party at this point.
I’m a big Jones fan. I absolutely love his athleticism and tenacity on the mound, dude is a competitor. But, he needs to harness his command and develop a bonafide third pitch. This has “very strong month one and unrealistic fan expectations, then struggles mightily as the league and professional hitters adjust” written all over it. Battling adversity is one thing if you are adequately prepared, but this is more about setting up someone to fail, which is completely different.
Nolan Ryan would never have made it to the major leagues if you use that criteria. Success and failure are parts of every athlete’s life and are the main motivators for improvement. Fear of failure is a path toward never trying and working through struggles helps build strength. There’s little a true competitor enjoys more than a challenge and taking it easy on someone like that can actually set them back instead of moving them forward.
I don’t know Jones, but he seems like a real competitor and sure doesn’t strike me as someone who’s fragile and might unravel if everything doesn’t go perfectly, which it won’t. I suspect if the Pirates send him down it will be because of the ever present service-time issue and not because he’s not ready.
Command is never going to be his strong point. His is at least as good as Oviedo's, and Oviedo managed OK in 2024. If the idea is you wait until his command is ideal before bringing him up, he's never coming up.
Possibly they'll view it as giving Jones the opportunity to see what he needs to work on by facing MLB hitters and then send him down to work on that third pitch and/or command in general.
I don't like the idea of burning a year of service time for a few extra weeks this year, but I think where I'm at is to give him an Opening Day roster spot almost like a September call-up with the understanding that he'll see what he needs to work on and then go back to AAA to work on it.
Idk, he’s not a very efficient pitcher. The residual effects on the bullpen, especially at the beginning of the season could be extremely counterproductive. There is really no reason to rush this decision. I get the results have looked good this spring, but with the younger guys like Jones, it’s more about the process at this point. He will get his opportunity.
They certainly appear to be acting as if Jones is in the rotation. How many dudes destined for the minors are getting stretched out to 5 innings in regular spring training games?
The Chase Anderson part of the story…. (Not him specifically, so much, but the general ‘Chase Anderson’ pitcher)
Can’t say enough times how nice it feels to be one of the clubs that don’t have a spot for a Chase, versus yesterdays oppo who is one of the teams awaiting final spring cuts, needing badly to find anything even resembling a MLB pitcher among the castoffs.
Who knows, maybe the quality and quantity of arms in the pipeline will turn out to be a mirage, but for now it just feels good to be in a place where catching lightning in a bottle with journeyman arms would be a very nice bonus, versus being the only way the club can roll out a half competent staff. And a place where if said journeyman turns out to be ‘meh’ in a bottle, or worse yet 💩 in a bottle, they don’t have to just keep rolling him out every five anyway cause they have no better options.
That is an intriguing aspect of the story. I was surprised he got a guaranteed deal from the Red Sox. It’ll be interesting to follow him and see how he does compared to the 5 we choose to run out.
For those not in attendance here Jones fastballs was his least impressive pitch as he had trouble locating it. The slider repeatedly bailed him out of count or pressure situations- it was really good.
Not sure why but two walks were lead off walks which will burn him eventually. The guy is one of the best pitchers in the system and he’s proving it pitch by pitch.
The batters however looked like they went out and PARTIED after the rain out Friday night at T&A Tampa. Errors and awful swings… it wasn’t good.
Davis I saw working on back field on his catching form on jugs gun. Dude is working on it.
I see Jones taking the Oviedo heavy slider approach in able to succeed at least for now. The fastball lacks command, both curve and change needs refinement. I’m not sure if more time in AAA is the better place for his development.
I think Pirates keep Jones on OD roster and start him in one of the games in Miami. Big ballpark vs a mediocre lineup seems like a good recipe for his first MLB start.
OR, start him in DC against the Nats and then I get to see his major league debut in person lol
The ideal would be to start Jones in the majors but send him down for a few weeks when others (Skenes, German, Lauer) are ready to both save innings (he's never pitched through September) and service time. But of course he could pitch so well that sending him down wouldn't be an option if they wanted to maintain any credibility about prioritizing winning in '24. More likely, though, is he'll experience some struggles due to command and they'll be justified in sending him down.
This is obviously the conundrum the FO faces. I don’t think anyone would disagree that Skenes and Jones are currently two of their five best starters. However, both guys have major boxes to check before a full time promotion. Not saying development cannot continue at the big league level, but it doesn’t serve either party at this point.
I’m a big Jones fan. I absolutely love his athleticism and tenacity on the mound, dude is a competitor. But, he needs to harness his command and develop a bonafide third pitch. This has “very strong month one and unrealistic fan expectations, then struggles mightily as the league and professional hitters adjust” written all over it. Battling adversity is one thing if you are adequately prepared, but this is more about setting up someone to fail, which is completely different.
Nolan Ryan would never have made it to the major leagues if you use that criteria. Success and failure are parts of every athlete’s life and are the main motivators for improvement. Fear of failure is a path toward never trying and working through struggles helps build strength. There’s little a true competitor enjoys more than a challenge and taking it easy on someone like that can actually set them back instead of moving them forward.
I don’t know Jones, but he seems like a real competitor and sure doesn’t strike me as someone who’s fragile and might unravel if everything doesn’t go perfectly, which it won’t. I suspect if the Pirates send him down it will be because of the ever present service-time issue and not because he’s not ready.
So, in short, you think he’s fully formed and ready for action to be effective? Lack of third pitch and wonky command be damned?
Command is never going to be his strong point. His is at least as good as Oviedo's, and Oviedo managed OK in 2024. If the idea is you wait until his command is ideal before bringing him up, he's never coming up.
Possibly they'll view it as giving Jones the opportunity to see what he needs to work on by facing MLB hitters and then send him down to work on that third pitch and/or command in general.
I don't like the idea of burning a year of service time for a few extra weeks this year, but I think where I'm at is to give him an Opening Day roster spot almost like a September call-up with the understanding that he'll see what he needs to work on and then go back to AAA to work on it.
Idk, he’s not a very efficient pitcher. The residual effects on the bullpen, especially at the beginning of the season could be extremely counterproductive. There is really no reason to rush this decision. I get the results have looked good this spring, but with the younger guys like Jones, it’s more about the process at this point. He will get his opportunity.
He’s a kid. Therefore, he’s automatically better than any veteran.
Hold up, have you seen his spring training ERA?!?
They certainly appear to be acting as if Jones is in the rotation. How many dudes destined for the minors are getting stretched out to 5 innings in regular spring training games?
The Chase Anderson part of the story…. (Not him specifically, so much, but the general ‘Chase Anderson’ pitcher)
Can’t say enough times how nice it feels to be one of the clubs that don’t have a spot for a Chase, versus yesterdays oppo who is one of the teams awaiting final spring cuts, needing badly to find anything even resembling a MLB pitcher among the castoffs.
Who knows, maybe the quality and quantity of arms in the pipeline will turn out to be a mirage, but for now it just feels good to be in a place where catching lightning in a bottle with journeyman arms would be a very nice bonus, versus being the only way the club can roll out a half competent staff. And a place where if said journeyman turns out to be ‘meh’ in a bottle, or worse yet 💩 in a bottle, they don’t have to just keep rolling him out every five anyway cause they have no better options.
That is an intriguing aspect of the story. I was surprised he got a guaranteed deal from the Red Sox. It’ll be interesting to follow him and see how he does compared to the 5 we choose to run out.
For those not in attendance here Jones fastballs was his least impressive pitch as he had trouble locating it. The slider repeatedly bailed him out of count or pressure situations- it was really good.
Not sure why but two walks were lead off walks which will burn him eventually. The guy is one of the best pitchers in the system and he’s proving it pitch by pitch.
The batters however looked like they went out and PARTIED after the rain out Friday night at T&A Tampa. Errors and awful swings… it wasn’t good.
Davis I saw working on back field on his catching form on jugs gun. Dude is working on it.
One more game today then back to the burgh.
The fastball sets up the slider, so it is his co-#1 pitch, whether it's a ball or strike.
That ain't gonna get him through many big league lineups three times...
It's a 5-inning gig now. That's all we need, maybe a batter or two in the 6th. And then call to the pen.